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The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

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Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#161

Post by dr_dshiv »

throwaway2331 wrote: post #121
soylentcola wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. It's why I switched from Vyvanse (lisdexamfetamine - basically just d-amp bound to lysine which is then metabolized into d-amp during digestion) to IR generic Adderall (a mix of d-amp and l-amp). Any unwanted effects (insomnia if I take it too late, etc) are almost entirely due to the l-amp, but the slow release of Vyvanse made it essentially impossible to titrate and my options were either to take a dose so low…

I had the same experience with vyvanse. Insomnia and ADHD medication are a dangerous combo -- one that's hardly recognizable until it's too late. In my experience, I've had to run the gamut on all the "other" ADHD drugs (ritalin, adderall, d-amphetamine ER, etc.) and then prove they weren't effective, for my insurance to finally approve it. I've heard of some people even going so far as to get prescription meth (deso…

> slavic nootropics and neuro-regenerative peptides (e.g. semax/NASA, BPC-500,

more info?

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#162

Post by HarryHirsch »

Scoundreller wrote: post #152
HideousKojima wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And there's a limit on how much you can buy at a time, you can only get 15 24-hour pills every 15 days, which means you need a regular pharmacy trip

FDA pressured loperamide manufacturers to stop selling large quantity bottles because people thought eating a whole bottle was a good idea. Problem: taking massive amounts of loperamide to get an opiate effect is a myth Of course, the manufacturers were all happy to fall in line anyway and dramatically raise per-tablet prices (and packaging!) Except one manufacturer. Several years ago, I bought a 200-ct bottle for US…

Tell me who needs 200-ct bottles of imodium. People who observe proper hygiene have food poisoning maybe once in 10 years (and whether a motility agent is a good idea in such cases is another question).

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#163

Post by cwkoss »

JudasGoat wrote: post #134

From what I read, the P2P method isn't new. "Preisler, who works at an electroplating factory and has been arrested twice in the U.S. for his work with methamphetamine, says he isn't surprised traffickers have turned to P2P. "P2P is old school," he said. "Hell, I used to cook by that route circa 1980." The fight has come full circle. In the 1980s, the U.S. government severely restricted access to P2P seeking to curta…

Priesler goes by "Uncle Fester", and wrote "Secrets of Methamphetamine Manufacture" - he's effectively the expert on clandestine meth manufacturing. He writes some interesting, and kind of terrifying, books.

https://wikileaks.org/gifiles/attach/130/130179_Secrets_of_M...

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#164

Post by girvo »

Scoundreller wrote: post #152
HideousKojima wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And there's a limit on how much you can buy at a time, you can only get 15 24-hour pills every 15 days, which means you need a regular pharmacy trip

FDA pressured loperamide manufacturers to stop selling large quantity bottles because people thought eating a whole bottle was a good idea. Problem: taking massive amounts of loperamide to get an opiate effect is a myth Of course, the manufacturers were all happy to fall in line anyway and dramatically raise per-tablet prices (and packaging!) Except one manufacturer. Several years ago, I bought a 200-ct bottle for US…

It’s not a myth so much as it’s not particularly effective: large doses of it (dangerously so, I might add, people should not do this) are quite effective in getting rid of opioid withdrawals — and not just the peripheral effects.

In extremely large doses it has a distinctly weird feeling. I wouldn’t call it getting high, so I’d suppose that is indeed a myth, but gosh it feels hard on your heart at those doses.

Typically it’s addicts trying to avoid withdrawals (and who felt they did not have access to other opioid replacement therapies for various reasons) that tried that. Some died.

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#165

Post by gunfighthacksaw »

Zarathust wrote: post #85
kens wrote: post #64

The article mentions the ban in 2006 of over-the-counter sales of Sudafed (pseudoephedrine). One of my favorite satirical articles is "A simple and convenient synthesis of pseudoephedrine from N-methylamphetamine". (The joke being that Sudafed is now hard to purchase while meth is readily available.) https://www.improbable.com/airchives/paperair/volume19/v19i3...

In Canada you can still buy that over the counter. You get id-ed and they keep a record of your purchases, but since it's now generic pills it is now much cheaper than it was before

I didn’t get IDed either of the times I’ve bought a box.

First time was in 2019: I went to Walmart for something for my ears on flights, after some back and forth the pharmacist recommended me pseudoephedrine.

Second time was in Sobeys last month (can fly again, yaaay) and I asked for it directly. The pharmacist had some trouble finding it, but sold it to me with no further issue.

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#166

Post by Scoundreller »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #162
Scoundreller wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FDA pressured loperamide manufacturers to stop selling large quantity bottles because people thought eating a whole bottle was a good idea. Problem: taking massive amounts of loperamide to get an opiate effect is a myth Of course, the manufacturers were all happy to fall in line anyway and dramatically raise per-tablet prices (and packaging!) Except one manufacturer. Several years ago, I bought a 200-ct bottle for US…

Tell me who needs 200-ct bottles of imodium. People who observe proper hygiene have food poisoning maybe once in 10 years (and whether a motility agent is a good idea in such cases is another question).

People that ignore expiry dates. And at least in our household's case, a clinically ignored case of endometriosis.

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#167

Post by __blockcipher__ »

coolspot wrote: post #90
throwaway2331 wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adding on: the problem with vyvanse is that there's no way to mess around with the dosage to get it "just right." It's like a more strict version of extended release (EX) and timed release formulations (there's a difference!). Vyvanse is metabolized to d-amphetamine in your blood cells (the specific mechanism escapes me right now), unlike the regular non-prodrug versions which get "metabolized" first in your stomach…

Thank you for in-depth explanation. Is there a book or some website where all this knowledge of ADHD medication usage nuances is collected in one place? Like a missing ADHD manual?

Not that I know of. One of the side effects of amphetamine usage is compulsively researching details about amphetamine, so that’s where my knowledge comes from :)

Certainly need to read some of the research literature and places like /r/DrugNerds (that community is super legit). The public health/doctor-y type websites are the worst for actually getting info since they never go into details and often give bad advice, so I’d stay away from the “traditional” resources if you’re trying to go deep

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#168

Post by jac241 »

kayodelycaon wrote: post #87
dynm wrote: post #2

Around a week ago, I came across this link here on HN that suggested that there's a new form of meth: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28938888 The theory is that new meth is based on a synthesis using a chemical called P2P rather than the old synthesis that used ephedrine. There are claims that this new form of meth is chemically different in some what that started creating schizophrenia around 2017. However, wh…

From what I've read of schizophrenia[1] it is highly inherited and unlikely that any drug would cause it. A sufficient amount of stress is known to trigger or quicken the emergence of schizophrenia in people already predisposed to it. When it comes to studying this, you have to separate out: * The high rates of drug abuse by people with mental illness. * The correlation drug use with other sources of stress. Drug use…

Maybe it doesn't cause permanent psychosis but people do become psychotic due to it and need to spend the night cooling off in the psych ED.

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#169

Post by girvo »

tigershark wrote: post #159
dcolkitt wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Much of the effects of any intoxicant are culturally constructed. Alcohol is widely known for causing aggression, but this effect doesn’t seem to exist in cultures without that association. Nor does it exist in double-blind studies, yet the placebo group becomes more aggressive. You can start with two chemically identical intoxicants, and either by marketing or random path dependencies one gains a reputation in the s…

> In many ways that makes these rumor filled, science light, unsubstantiated media stories about “this is the most dangerous drug ever” incredibly irresponsible. The stories themselves create the cultural preconditions around encouraging more self-destructive behavior among users. What about krokodile?

What about it?

Desomorphine is not any more inherently dangerous than other opioids (so, still quite dangerous of course).

The synthesis pathway that Krokodil producers used are quite bad and unrefined, but quite surprisingly do work and does appear to produce desomorphine.

The problem was the producers were usually addicts who then injected the reactions solvent mixture, rather than extracting their product.

Re: The main thing about Phenylacetone meth is that there's so much of it

#170

Post by __blockcipher__ »

e40 wrote: post #122
__blockcipher__ wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meth doesn't have to be smoked, you can just eat the crystals orally, but meth abusers uusally don't do that because it's not nearly as fun. The pills they're referring to, 30 M ( https://www.drugs.com/imprints/30-m-8232.html ), are oxycodone pills (a powerful opioid), but he's likely actually specifically referring to pressed fent (or fent analogue) pills that are made to look like real oxycodone pills. Or perhaps a…

> but he's likely actually specifically referring to pressed fent (or fent analogue) pills that are made to look like real oxycodone pills That sounds like a really, really bad idea. Wow.

Yeah that and the general inclusion of fent hotspots in Heroin and the like is why overdoes have skyrocketed over the last 5+ years. And then COVID [lockdowns] in my opinion cranked the growth in ODs even higher. It was growing at something like 11% in 2019 and then in 2020 it spiked like 30% to something like 70,000 overdose deaths in the US
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