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Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

element.io

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Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#271

Post by pimeys »

zfnmxt wrote: post #172
pimeys wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is possible. I've been running my own for a year, but it takes quite a hefty server at least with Synapse, and it's not cheaper compared to the quite nice 5 euros a month pricing here. If you want to give it a try, this is what I used: https://github.com/spantaleev/matrix-docker-ansible-deploy

You can run Synapse on a cheapo VPS for <$5/month; it doesn't exactly require much.

I have Synapse and quite quite many bridges running and especially syncing a newbdevice takes a long time.

Hope I could go with Conduit at some point.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#272

Post by feanaro »

zepto wrote: post #226
TeMPOraL wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From your POV, the threat model is equivalent to your partner being compromised themselves, and reporting your conversation to criminals/terrorists/law enforcement/intelligence agencies/boogeyman du jour. Bridges don't install themselves in place of platform's messengers - it's the user that has to make an active choice to use one. If you don't trust your partner making a right choice for both of you, you can't reall…

> From your POV, the threat model is equivalent to your partner being compromised themselves, and reporting your conversation to criminals/terrorists/law enforcement/intelligence agencies/boogeyman du jour. Not even close. I can evaluate the likelyhood of my partner being compromised. I can’t evaluate the likelyhood of a gateway I may not even know about being compromised. The introduction of these gateways makes the…

> Not even close. I can evaluate the likelyhood of my partner being compromised. I can’t evaluate the likelyhood of a gateway I may not even know about being compromised.

Why? It is your partner that is deciding to use what is essentially a Signal client installed on a remote server controlled by Element. If it is true that you are able to estimate this likelihood for your partner, this fact should already have been accounted for in the calculation.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#273

Post by freeopinion »

idrios wrote: post #266
freeopinion wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If privacy mattered that much to you, you wouldn't depend on Signal to encrypt your messages. You would encrypt them before handing them to Signal. So you should have an encrypted message that you hand to Signal. Signal encrypts it again and hands it to the bridge. Eventually, whether at the bridge or at the other end or wherever, something decrypts the Signal message. Then the person you are communicating with appli…

This is a very all or nothing mentality. It's also kind of like saying you should put locks on your locks. Signal's core reason for existing is that it puts a focus on privacy. They say this all over their homepage [0]. One of the founders of WhatsApp donated $50M to Signal [1] out of regret for how WhatsApp shifted away from privacy after being acquired by Facebook. The entire project is freely visible to anyone on…

For most people, privacy is a nice-to-have thing. When it's just nice to have, Signal checks that box.

If your life depended on it, you would be foolish to depend solely on Signal.

How nice it is that encryption has emerged from the dark corners of life and death to become a fashion accessory. But for those that still exist in the world beyond fashion, your criticism seems naive.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#274

Post by grassjumper »

tremon wrote: post #136
arianvanp wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the bridge is not hosted by me but by them. I need to trust matrix not to MITM me

Yes, in the same way that you need to trust Whatsapp not to MITM you. What's your perceived difference between these trust levels, other than one is something you pay for with money, and the other doesn't require money?

The Signal protocol (which WhatsApp still uses, I presume) is very good. WhatsApp can't MITM it.

Element, on the other hand, is MITM by design.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#276

Post by zepto »

feanaro wrote: post #272
zepto wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> From your POV, the threat model is equivalent to your partner being compromised themselves, and reporting your conversation to criminals/terrorists/law enforcement/intelligence agencies/boogeyman du jour. Not even close. I can evaluate the likelyhood of my partner being compromised. I can’t evaluate the likelyhood of a gateway I may not even know about being compromised. The introduction of these gateways makes the…

> Not even close. I can evaluate the likelyhood of my partner being compromised. I can’t evaluate the likelyhood of a gateway I may not even know about being compromised. Why? It is your partner that is deciding to use what is essentially a Signal client installed on a remote server controlled by Element. If it is true that you are able to estimate this likelihood for your partner, this fact should already have been…

This is only true now that Element have introduced this compromised way to access signal.

So yes, Element have introduced a new fact that downgrades everyone’s estimate.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#277

Post by peoplefromibiza »

fimdomeio wrote: post #100
personjerry wrote: post #35

Back in the day before the rise of Facebook, there was an open source service that combined all the popular messaging protocols - MSN, AoL, IRC, etc. It was called Pidgin[0], and it never got particularly big. I see the same thing here. While it's interesting, I'm failing to see what the use case is. What's the niche that needs this solved in a big way? [0] https://www.pidgin.im/

Back in the day and for a little while platforms companies thought to at least have a common language (xmpp). Then they thought it would be a better idea if we all had 10 different apps on our phones for text messages. There's no reason for standardization and interoperability not to be forced on these companies. When you sent a physical letter you have to follow some standards on the envelope addresses, when you mak…

think about this: WA protocol was simply XMPP with shorter labels (one character when possible)

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#278

Post by MisterTea »

pmlnr wrote: post #110
tao_oat wrote: post #97

> It’s also worth noting that end-to-end encryption is necessarily broken as messages to (and from) WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram pass across the bridge(s). The bridge(s) operates in Element’s trusted EMS environment, with no content scanning or datamining, but currently bridged conversations are not stored end-to-end encrypted in Matrix (they will be in the future). As a Signal user, I kind of don't want this to tak…

I want this to take off. I'm tired of having to follow trends because people suddenly think there's a new shinyshinytrendy thing around: IRC to ICQ to MSN to Skype to Google Talk to Facebook Messenger to Whatsapp to Signal. Pidgin is good (I also miss the ancient Trillian, even though it was closed source), but limited to a local device. There are XMPP Transports as well for these (see https://git.eta.st/eta/whatsxmp…

> I'm tired of having to follow trends

Then don't. I have none of those things save for IRC. I get all my work done and live a full life.

Re: Element One – All of Matrix, WhatsApp, Signal and Telegram in one place

#280

Post by ruffrey »

personjerry wrote: post #35

Back in the day before the rise of Facebook, there was an open source service that combined all the popular messaging protocols - MSN, AoL, IRC, etc. It was called Pidgin[0], and it never got particularly big. I see the same thing here. While it's interesting, I'm failing to see what the use case is. What's the niche that needs this solved in a big way? [0] https://www.pidgin.im/

Fun fact, pidgin was developed by Mark Spencer, who also wrote Asterisk PBX and currently builds open source flight avionics.
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