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Where have all the insects gone?

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Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#131

Post by farias0 »

Jensson wrote: post #89
farias0 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, probably? If we had elected good officials at least. I'm not defending socialism at all, but if you accept the fact that this kind of thing happens because there's no monetary incentive for the industry to avoid it, then the logical conclusion is that under a system not motivated by profit this would be less likely to happen. But what I'm sure you are aware of this line of thinking. What is the argument again…

> If we had elected good officials at least. That is the argument against it. If you had elected good officials they would have created regulations against this already. Fact is that we can't elect good officials in the current system. Either it is because people would rather have more goods instead of caring about nature, or the system is corrupt and politicians use their power to enrich themselves rather than doing…

The problem with US politicians is that they are sold out to the private sector. This is a problem that would obviously not exist if there was no private sector, or if it was weaker, which is the "what if" of the discussion.

Sure, then we could elect politicians that are bad in different ways, but then this becomes a discussion against socialism, which is not what I'm intending here. I'm only talking about socialism hypothetically. My point is that we can't ignore capitalism's shortcomings. We have to understand what having profit as a main motivator leads to, so we can deal with it.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#132

Post by cranekam »

bluGill wrote: post #109
jonny_eh wrote: post #71

> He spent a sabbatical conducting field work on Trinidad and Tobago and in Suriname. What a great example for why we need the Oxford Comma.

No, that is why you need a semicolon. The Oxford comma is good as well, but what you showed was where a semicolon is called for.

I don't think a semicolon is right here. Are you proposing this?

"He spent a sabbatical conducting field work on Trinidad and Tobago; and in Suriname."

That sounds very odd indeed — I wouldn't say the sentence with a semicolon-sized gap in it and reading it with one is jarring.

There's nothing wrong with the original sentence. When I read and say it I do so with the same cadence as "He spent a sabbatical conducting field work on Bermuda and in Suriname." The "and" in Trinidad and Tobago is just coincidence — it's not part of the sentence structure. If a reader doesn't know that Trinidad and Tobago is a place then perhaps the sentence's "in x and y and on z" would provoke them into finding this out.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#134

Post by AnimalMuppet »

LanceH wrote: post #87
revolvingocelot wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lots of downvoting, as you're about to find out. For some reason, HN really really hates the idea that there's enormous monetary incentive to ignore existential problems caused by modern capitalism. Probably because, as Jeff Hammerbacher said, "the best minds of my generation are thinking about how to make people click ads. That sucks."

I think HN really hates the histrionics that started this thread, "They heroically died for our capitalist masters". When people talk about HN becoming Reddit, this is one of the things they are talking about.

Yup. We are not here for that kind of manipulative nonsense. Take it somewhere else.

The same point could have been made without that garbage, and would have been better for it.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#135

Post by Jensson »

ashtonkem wrote: post #17
missedthecue wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only the government had nationalised industry, these bugs would be alive?

[flagged]

> the solution to these types of problems are incompatible with capitalism as we practice it today.

It isn't, regulations to price in externalities is a cornerstone of modern capitalism as practiced everywhere in the west. If your government isn't doing its job then you shouldn't blame capital, you should blame your government, your voters or the system you use to count votes and elect officials.

If companies can just buy politicians then the problem lies with your democracy and not with those companies.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#136

Post by cowmix »

john61 wrote: post #111
thisiscorrect wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could that be explained by improved aerodynamics of cars now compared to then? Has that been studied?

I drive my old motorcycle with the same big windshield since the 90ies. Insects are dramatically less on it now than 20 years ago.

Yup.. I'm 50 and I will attest there is NO DOUBT insects populations have declined. It's crazy.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#137

Post by BobbyJo »

pengaru wrote: post #129

Last year I had a jarring experience driving through some of the agricultural land near the Salton Sea en route to Bombay Beach coming down from JTNP, taking back roads. The general region is desert, water and food is scarce, but through this agricultural zone there's this dense pocket of food and water on the surface. I was in a Miata with the top down, and the amount of chemicals they were using to keep the pests/i…

Drove through Texas agricultural land in spring of 2016. Windows up, not a convertible, and I was still horribly affected for 2 weeks. My eyes and nose burned the moment we started driving by the fields, and my nose continued to run and drain for 2 weeks after.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#138

Post by amatecha »

elif wrote: post #122

In my neighborhood, there were 2 cases of West Nile virus detected in humans in June/July. Since then, the city have contracted a corporation called BugStars to drive down every street in my neighborhood (downtown, 10k population) and the four around it releasing poison directly into the air every Wednesday night. There was no notice given to any of us, and only after investigating were we able to figure out why ever…

So like.. lawsuit? I'd definitely be calling up a lawyer (in addition to the city/police)... that's _seriously_ effed up. What if you had a home business selling honey/beeswax? That's just the most obvious example... not to mention the human-hazardous aspect of spraying this stuff!

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#139

Post by istorical »

nickff wrote: post #27
ashtonkem wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Historically, the capitalist countries have been much less-polluted ('cleaner') and more environmentally friendly in general than the communist countries. With respect to 'socialist' countries, the correlations depend on exactly how you define socialism, and which countries you include/exclude.

The alternative to 'capitalism as we see it today' is not socialism. It's capitalism without regulatory capture and functional regulatory bodies that have teeth and use them.

Re: Where have all the insects gone?

#140

Post by csmoak »

eddiecalzone wrote: post #110
inter_netuser wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

meaning bugs are doing well in Texas, but not nowhere else? Really weird

Meaning Texas has the highest speed limits in the country

The speed limit went up to 85 in Texas. It seemed to max out at 75 or 80 in other places. I'm not sure if an extra 5-10mph made the difference, but it could have.
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