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How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

bambooimport.com

171–180 of 226 posts

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#172

Beautiful bamboo home featured on TED and AppleTV, for reference: https://ibuku.com/ Note, little to no bamboo lumber used. I think these kinds of homes are an excellent idea for the billion or two people living in suitable climate for it. And maybe a bamboo lumber building can survive in harsher places, too. We will need to experiment to find out.

"I think these kinds of homes are an excellent idea for the billion or two people living in suitable climate for it."

Yes, but people and bamboo have coexisted in these places for a long time, and majority of buildings aren't made of bamboo. So obviously other materials are cheaper/easier to work with otherwise I suspect they would have selected it as building material of choice.

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#173

If you start with something that is natural and sustainable (for example, bamboo), and you add to it something that is neither (for example, glue), then you end up with something that is neither natural nor sustainable. Sorry.

Glues were made from animals for centuries and are animal glue is still phenomenal for a number of woodworking applications. It's also much more expensive than synthetic glue. This does not mean that a glued lumber product is necessarily unnatural or unsustainable, but rather that the price may end up being higher, and the properties different, when using a natural glue.

Totally right, but one thing I learned recently - hide glue isn't that much more expensive than the same manufacturers' PVA glues.

(For folks who aren't familiar, though, animal glues aren't really substitutable for things like plywood; the ability to undo a hide glue joint is valuable in furnituremaking but not in plywood composition.)

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#174

I posted this lower down as a comment, but some might be interested to know what specific glue is being used: Most manufactured wood building materials contain one of these two types of formaldehyde-based glues: * Phenol-formaldehyde (PF) * Urea-formaldehyde (UF). Its water resistant properties make phenol-formaldehyde glue more effective for production of exterior wood materials. Urea-formaldehyde glue, cheaper and…

What’s with the distinctly sweet wood smell when you buy Ikea furniture, is it formaldehyde?

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#175
post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but ‘synthetic’ is a weird word. At root it just means ‘made via synthesis’. Rayon is not made by synthesizing cellulose, though - it is made by extracting natural cellulose. You could say the fibers are synthesized - but cotton needs to go through a spinning process too. Where do you draw the line between ‘synthesis’ and ‘manufacturing’? Sure, for rayon the cellulose extraction process is chemical, unlike the…

> Sure, but ‘synthetic’ is a weird word. Every word is weird if you think about it too long. At least in the US, this is pretty simple, even if it offends the sensibilities of category pedants. "Natural" fibers are cotton, wool, linen, etc. Processing is fine, so long as it isn't "too processed". It is "Synthetic" if it ends in '-on', or feels like plastic or rubber.

Right.

But thinking of Rayon and viscose as ‘synthetic’ means people assume it is not biodegradable, which isn’t the case. It’s about as biodegradable as cotton, or cardboard.

In fact cardboard and paper are good analogs - I think people are comfortable thinking of them as ‘processed’ natural products, but not ‘synthetic’. There is value in getting people to think of rayon as more like that than true synthetics like nylon and polyester, which create non biodegradable micro plastic pollutants.

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#176
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the themes in this thread is reminding people that it's not actually bamboo, it's a bamboo composite--sort of like plywood. I doesn't work without petrochemical glues. I think it's fairer to say your build is 40%-ish bamboo composite. When we're calling it bamboo we're doing that industry's greenwashing marketing for them. Cool guitar!

If the mentioned bamboo composite is 95% bamboo and 5% glue (going by comment from hwillis), isn't it fair to say it's 40%-ish bamboo? 5% glue is far from something like carbon composite, where most content is epoxy. Common wood surface treatment is probably more than 5%, yet we don't call it a wood composite. IMO, total surface sealant makes more of a material difference than 5% glue on the inside.

that would be 38% bamboo then.

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#177
post #72

There is more glue than bamboo in the bamboo products, but thaks to the marketing department they are ECO, and friendly and yada yada... Just look at the proces to get decent thich board/beam.

Engineered lumber (MDF, OSB, glulam... all of them actually) also involves the same glues and chemical treatments used in bamboo, and both use formaldehide-based glues which are known carcinogens.

Would lignin-based glues be a suitable alternative in terms of cost, effectiveness and long-term reliability (stability) or hasn't there been sufficient development to make them viable yet?

Alternatively, could we revert back to safer traditional animal-based glues as a practical/viable option? That said, I'd guess that these days cost would be prohibitive as well as having environmental concerns not to mention their long-term reliability in that composites made with them may be prone to delamination, etc. (my experience is that animal glues get brittle with age).

In a similar vein, one of the major problems with MDF, medium density fiberboard/particleboard, is the fact that the amount of binder used is quite inadequate which means that it has limited durability/lifespan. This is a two-edged sword of course, the more binder the more expensive it will be but its durability will be increased; on the other hand, unless the binder is environmentally friendly then sooner or later we'll have a polution problem. Nevertheless, the high-grade high-density stuff can be extraordinarily durable (thus it's much less likely to end up in landfills). It seems to me that we urgently need new very durable glues and binders that are also cheap, safe and environmentally friendly.

That logically segues into the matter of artificial wood. I know, that process has been pitifully slow for obvious reasons but it seems to me we need a solution urgently as we're fast running out of both building and cabinet-quality grade lumber.

(Whilst, we may be able to keep up supply with fast growing building-grade lumber such as pinus radiata (and importantly bamboo), quality timbers are in desperately short supply and will continue to be so into the foreseeable future. For example, we've precious little of timbers such as sandalwood, lignum vitae, ebony, and various Dalbergia genus rosewoods (retusa/Cocobolo, nigra/Brazilian rosewood, melanoxylon/African blackwood, etc.), as many take several hundred years to mature and no one had the foresight to plant forests of them back in the 18th Century! Thus, all of them are on the CITIES watchlist for good reason and have been so for decades.

Moreover, they're essentially unprocurable for any practical purpose, and even if you can buy small quantities of them legally, then they're hideously expensive. For instance, African blackwood costs a fortune at well over $10,000/cubic meter, and when it comes to sandalwood we actually buy it by the gram ($85/100g): https://ventured.com/most-expensive-woods-in-the-world/

Thus, there is no solution other than to artificially manufacture† excellent, high quality, chemically-similar (complete with lignin, cellulose, etc.) facsimilies of these wonderful and very beautiful timbers.

__

† Even if we're still a long way off from having artificial timber as a practical reality, there seems to be an obvious way forward for at least part of the manufacturing process - that of additive manufacturing/3D printing, as the number of textures and designs it affords are essentially endless.

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#178
post #170

This was interesting in light of an interview I was just listening to yesterday, a CBC podcast [1] talking about the benefits of mass timber (glued wood) for large highrise building construction. There were two guests on, both sounded like environmentalists, with the first one (Michael Green) saying that mass timber was "currently the best tool we have to address climate impact and in the building materials for a lar…

At the bottom of the OP link is the price for a 4x8' sheet of bamboo plywood. It's listed for 295 euroos or $342USD. I'm not sure there is a 'regular' wood sheet that is even close to that cost. It's truly a specialized product and unless there are more economical bamboo sheet goods, no one would ever build with this.

I started searching for bamboo exterior sidings because of this post and it seems to be about the same price like hardwood sidings. Bit cheaper than padauk.

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#179
post #33

Long time lurker here, first time poster. I got pulled into the rabbit hole of building guitars at home during the covid lockdowns. My first build used traditional "tonewoods" (mahogany, ebony, rosewood etc.) and while purchasing materials for my second build, I stumbled upon bamboo boards on a German wood retailed shop. Compared the properties to the wood I wanted to use for parts of it (mainly the core/neck and fre…

Awesome looking guitar! I noticed you use the Planet Waves tuners. I love those as well, they're much more practical as they cut the strings for you. I wonder why they don't make them in more traditional colors, or why other manufacturers don't provide similar solutions. Everyone else makes just regular and locking tuners, not the locking-and-cutting tuners. For a performing amateur musician, the ability to change yo…

The original klusons tuners on the strats, you don't cut the strings at all.

https://www.amazon.ca/Kluson-SD9105MN-Vintage-Tuning-Machine...

Re: How is bamboo lumber made? (2016)

#180

This was interesting in light of an interview I was just listening to yesterday, a CBC podcast [1] talking about the benefits of mass timber (glued wood) for large highrise building construction. There were two guests on, both sounded like environmentalists, with the first one (Michael Green) saying that mass timber was "currently the best tool we have to address climate impact and in the building materials for a lar…

When thinking about “carbon stores” - it is significantly more preferable to turn managed forests into manufactured wood products for buildings and furniture (where the CO2 gets functionally stored and then possibly tossed in a landfill far in the future) to turning those forests into wood pellets to be burned as biomass.

Managed forestry has the ability to, relatively trivially and particularly when compared to other “carbon sequestration alternatives” lock in decent magnitudes of carbon as we figure out our energy system.

Particularly helps when comparing to other building material options (bricks, concrete, steel all very energy intensive and not decarbonized yet).

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