Tesla made $1.6 billion in Q3, is switching to LFP batteries globally

Post by bryanlarsen » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 2:49 PM UTC

01100011 wrote: post #46

woeirua wrote: post #34

The potential for a massive jump in battery chemistry is why I personally have not purchased a BEV yet. I'm leasing a LEAF, which has been great overall, but I'm not going to buy until the battery chemistry is settled here in a few years. There's a high probability that every BEV on the road today will be considered antiquated (and potentially unsafe) in 5 years.

Yep. I feel like buying an EV now is like buying a $50,000 PC that will be obsolete the minute I take it home. EVs are insanely awesome though. I'm leasing a 2019 Bolt and after a month or so it's the best car I've ever driven. EV torque is a blast. With the type of driving I do I'm able to get by on a Type I charger at my apartment and a rare visit to a public charging station. I think one-pedal mode helps because I…

Post by JKCalhoun » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 2:57 PM UTC

andruby wrote: post #47

jtbayly wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you help me understand why you wouldn't just stay with the old Lead-Acid batteries? You can get a 150Ah for $110, for example, whereas this 100Ah you linked to is $376. I'm sure there are benefits, but I don't know much about batteries to understand why you'd make that tradeoff.

You can't discharge lead-acid as deeply as LFP without destroying longevity. So that 150Ah, probably only has 75Ah of useable capacity. The LFP battery will also last for ~5000 cycles, after which it'll still have ~80% capacity, and thus is still valuable. Lead acid only has a life of 500~1200 cycles. In other words: you'll have replaced the lead acid battery 4~10 times before you need to replace the LFP. IIRC, lead…

Post by jjav » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 7:56 PM UTC

MrDunham wrote: post #11

wffurr wrote: post #3

I found the point about the safer qualities of LFP battery chemistry reducing the overhead in the battery pack construction and thus preserving range despite lower capacity very interesting. Better range on a lower capacity means much better range per hour charging time.

Completely agree. I had a thermodynamics teacher in college say “in the history of transportation we’ve never switched to something powered by lower energy density [than the previous mode of transportation]" in other words “energy density wins the day".* That was running through my head when I read they were switching to technology with lower energy density but, to your point and to the article's point, it’s really a…

Post by woeirua » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 9:43 PM UTC

bryanlarsen wrote: post #51

01100011 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. I feel like buying an EV now is like buying a $50,000 PC that will be obsolete the minute I take it home. EVs are insanely awesome though. I'm leasing a 2019 Bolt and after a month or so it's the best car I've ever driven. EV torque is a blast. With the type of driving I do I'm able to get by on a Type I charger at my apartment and a rare visit to a public charging station. I think one-pedal mode helps because I…

Yes, if you can wait it's probably best to do so. But if you can't wait I imagine an EV bought today will hold its value a lot better than an ICE vehicle.

Post by dnautics » Thu, Oct 21, 2021, 10:20 PM UTC

fullstop wrote: post #49

onion2k wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't it be more like running, horse, better horse because of improved diet, better horse because of improved medicine, bike, better bike because of gears, better bike because of better gears, car, better car because of better fuel, better car because of better fuel, better car because of better fuel, better car because of better fuel, better car because of better fuel, better car because of better fuel...

At some point economical aspects are also important. If fuel was available for gas engines but it was rare, it doesn't matter how energy-dense it is if it's expensive.