I couldn't debug the code because of my name • Hacker News Board

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#81

Post by doubled112 » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:32 PM UTC

devrand wrote: post #49

sschueller wrote: post #31

Many years ago I could not access the apple developer panel because of the umlaut in my last name. It was eventually fixed but I was quite surprised that such a large company would run into such a basic issue.

My last name has an apostrophe in it which Apple apparently loves to embed directly into their JavaScript unescaped. For a long time neither I nor Apple could look up AppleCare status on my stuff as they were all linked to my Apple ID. The portal would thus require me to login, but then would just show a partially rendered page as my last name was causing an JS syntax error.

You'd think the apostrophe would be common enough they'd know it could happen, but no.

I love to enter it and see what each vendor and website's backend does with it.

The Staples Canada website, for example, returns it as ' (HTML escaped) A couple times I've logged in, it seems to escape a new character. I'm currently up to &amp;#39;

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#82

Post by mrweasel » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

It’s a pretty good test case. Similarly we found a number of bugs in a Django application and path handling, because I happend to be using Windows for six months, while the rest of the team was on Linux and Mac.

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#83

Post by irrational » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:38 PM UTC

sschueller wrote: post #31

Many years ago I could not access the apple developer panel because of the umlaut in my last name. It was eventually fixed but I was quite surprised that such a large company would run into such a basic issue.

>such a large company would run into such a basic issue

Every large company is just a conglomeration of smaller departments. Each department had individual contributors. Some individual contributor in that department wrote the code and if nobody else is their department caught it, nobody else at the large company would have caught it since they have their own work to consider and don't have time to look at other people's stuff.

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#84

Post by OskarS » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:42 PM UTC

amarshall wrote: post #70

For a list of strings that often cause problems to, e.g., add to a test suite, see https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings

An enormously useful list, I’ve used it several times, and it can often dig up some real nastiness if you haven’t been super careful.

This entry, by the way, is a fantastic little easter egg in the list: https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings/blo...

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#85

Post by Muromec » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:46 PM UTC

tremon wrote: post #77

dahfizz wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously the IDE is at fault here. Rider has a bug with Unicode. BUT, there is an easy workaround to avoid all Unicode related bugs: don't use Unicode. If that's morally objectionable for you, then you can keep fighting this fight.

I think it's reasonable to find that morally objectionable: English is the only language* that can be fully represented in ASCII, so pretending that ASCII is all you need excludes a large part of the world. * yes, by and large. Many languages make do, but even the European languages that use the same script as English cannot be fully represented: - Pretty much all mainland European languages use accents (simple examp…

Cyrillic-writing countries miss all of their alphabets and so does Greek.

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#86

Post by vertis » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:51 PM UTC

OskarS wrote: post #84

amarshall wrote: post #70

For a list of strings that often cause problems to, e.g., add to a test suite, see https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings

An enormously useful list, I’ve used it several times, and it can often dig up some real nastiness if you haven’t been super careful. This entry, by the way, is a fantastic little easter egg in the list: https://github.com/minimaxir/big-list-of-naughty-strings/blo...

No, seriously, wake up

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#87

Post by Kwpolska » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:54 PM UTC

pledess wrote: post #63

The article offers a solution of idea.system.path=${root.dir}/JetBrains/Rider/system but doesn't mention the C:\JetBrains directory permissions. Directory permissions under %LOCALAPPDATA% (the location that works for people without a Polish character) should restrict write access to one user. With the Windows default behavior, creating C:\JetBrains would inherit permissions from C:\ - and wouldn't restrict write acce…

If you are on a multi-user system, the path "C:\JetBrains" isn’t really ideal (what if other users also need Rider and have non-ASCII usernames?). That said, you can easily change file permissions on Windows if the default ones don’t work for you.

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#88

Post by zczc » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:56 PM UTC

ainar-g wrote: post #42

jasonpeacock wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the modern, post-ASCII computing world, we should no longer be willing to settle for the lowest-common-denominator of ASCII-only strings. There's no excuse for actively supported, paid products to have these problems today.

Especially if those products are developed by a company from Russia, where Cyrillic is used. For me, a Russian myself, this situation is honestly ridiculous.

Russian companies generally have ascii-only username policies

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#89

Post by Symbiote » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:59 PM UTC

tremon wrote: post #77

dahfizz wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously the IDE is at fault here. Rider has a bug with Unicode. BUT, there is an easy workaround to avoid all Unicode related bugs: don't use Unicode. If that's morally objectionable for you, then you can keep fighting this fight.

I think it's reasonable to find that morally objectionable: English is the only language* that can be fully represented in ASCII, so pretending that ASCII is all you need excludes a large part of the world. * yes, by and large. Many languages make do, but even the European languages that use the same script as English cannot be fully represented: - Pretty much all mainland European languages use accents (simple examp…

Not even Britain and Ireland can manage with ASCII: they need £ and €.

I agree with you, and disagree strongly with dahfizz, who is essentially telling people their name and language are unacceptable.

Re: I couldn't debug the code because of my name

#90

Post by thereddaikon » Wed, Oct 20, 2021, 7:59 PM UTC

q3k wrote: post #55

zanderwohl wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not strange to localize your name. In ASL for example, you could sign your English name letter-by-letter, but it's much more common to have a totally new sign for your name - usually a word combined with the first letter of your name. Taking part in a different system often means taking on another name.

It seems that you're implying computers are universally american and therefore people are expected to speak/use/adapt to american.

That's the harsh way to put it. A more diplomatic way is that computing is not unique in having deeply ingrained artifacts of the language and culture that birthed it and developed many of the paradigms.

Take anything having to do with seamanship. There are many terms that date back to early modern English that simply don't make sense anymore yet are accepted and universal because the British Empire had a large and enduring influence on maritime matters and happened to be at the forefront of most modern developments until about 70 years ago.

In some cases this is actually built into laws and industry practice. Pilots speak English. That's the rules. Don't like it? Invent the time machine and beat Wilbur and Orville. For much the same reason, science speaks Latin.

This technical debt is difficult if not impossible to overcome, especially in regards to computers because we still haven't cracked general purpose AI. Software will only accommodate what it was written to accommodate.

Recognizing the problem and working to fix it is all well and good. But its wise to understand that this wont be solved any time soon so in the meantime it is pragmatic to operate in such a way to maximize compatibility.

After all, I still have to call it a Foc'sle even if I think that's dumb or isn't inclusive of my culture.