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Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

nature.com

11–20 of 408 posts

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#11

Strange to think this discovery was made at the apex of the Byzantime Empire under Basil II. The Roman Empire was still somewhat of a thing.

It's interesting to contemplate some of these overlaps that don't normally come to mind. The Republic of Venice, for instance, was still a going concern, albeit on its last legs, when the United States was founded.

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#13

It begs the question then of what happened to them? Did they integrate with existing Native Americans? Or did they just die out? Are there stories from Native Americans in the area that report Norsemen in the area?

They sailed home to Greenland, presumably, and wrote about their adventures in sagas.

Unfortunately the indigenous peoples of Newfoundland (the Beothuk) were forced into starvation by the encroachment of European fishermen, so we don't have a lot of knowledge of their folklore or oral traditions.

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#14
"These sudden increases were caused by cosmic radiation events, and appear synchronously in dendrochronological records all around the world" #### That is a pretty interesting method for dating historical sites. I wonder how much it will change the records as future research is done globally.

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#15

It begs the question then of what happened to them? Did they integrate with existing Native Americans? Or did they just die out? Are there stories from Native Americans in the area that report Norsemen in the area?

> Did they integrate with existing Native Americans?

According to the article, no:

"The Icelandic sagas suggest that the Norse engaged in cultural exchanges with the Indigenous groups of North America. If these encounters indeed occurred, they may have had inadvertent outcomes, such as pathogen transmission, the introduction of foreign flora and fauna species, or even the exchange of human genetic information. Recent data from the Norse Greenlandic population, however, show no evidence of the last of these. It is a matter for future research how the year AD 1021 relates to overall transatlantic activity by the Norse. Nonetheless, our findings provide a chronological anchor for further investigations into the consequences of their westernmost expansion."

edit: re-reading this, they may have if they never returned to Greenland

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#17
post #4

The Icelandic sagas suggest that the Norse engaged in cultural exchanges with the Indigenous groups of North America34. If these encounters indeed occurred, they may have had inadvertent outcomes, such as pathogen transmission7, the introduction of foreign flora and fauna species, or even the exchange of human genetic information. Recent data from the Norse Greenlandic population, however, show no evidence of the las…

I think the consensus has been for some time that they showed up, caught some fish, logged a few trees, decided it sucked, and left, all in probably less than a decade.

According to some sources, one factor is that Newfoundland was so heavily populated with indigenous people that there wasn’t enough room for a Norse colony to grow. By the time the English made it back to Newfoundland, smallpox and other epidemics had devastated the indigenous population.

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#19
post #10

I thought this has been known for awhile. I visited the site in Newfoundland like 15 years ago. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Anse_aux_Meadows

I was taught that Leif Erikson led an expedition to Newfoundland over 20 years ago in public school.

"Transatlantic exploration took place centuries before the crossing of Columbus. Physical evidence for early European presence in the Americas can be found in Newfoundland, Canada1,2. However, it has thus far not been possible to determine when this activity took place3,4,5. Here we provide evidence that the Vikings were present in Newfoundland in AD 1021. We overcome the imprecision of previous age estimates by making use of the cosmic-ray-induced upsurge in atmospheric radiocarbon concentrations in AD 993 (ref. 6). "

Seems that before hand the evidence was circumstantial and while everyone was confident it was the case, they can now prove it with better dating techniques.

Re: Evidence for European presence in the Americas in AD 1021

#20
post #10

I thought this has been known for awhile. I visited the site in Newfoundland like 15 years ago. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L'Anse_aux_Meadows

> I thought this has been known for awhile What, in particular, are you referring to?

Leif Erikson? Popularized by Spongebob, no less.
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