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Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

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Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazing how even raising this as a question gets you downvoted. Yes, I’m sure it’s a factor, and needlessly so considering the vaccine seems to have a negligible effect on transmission. Prepared for my own downvotes after sharing some particularly uncomfortable truths.

I love how you both acknowledge that health care workers quitting over forced vaccination is an issue while immediately dismissing their actual experience of having worked through both pre and post vaccine covid world and first hand seeing the impact of mass vacination. If enough health care workers are willing to walk away from their jobs rather than take a vaccine, maybe you should take their observations seriously…

> If enough health care workers are willing to walk away from their jobs rather than take a vaccine, maybe you should take their observations seriously?

If you value their opinions in that way, you should get the vaccine.

https://www.ama-assn.org/press-center/press-releases/ama-sur...

"The American Medical Association (AMA) today released a new survey (PDF) among practicing physicians that shows more than 96 percent of surveyed U.S. physicians have been fully vaccinated for COVID-19, with no significant difference in vaccination rates across regions. Of the physicians who are not yet vaccinated, an additional 45 percent do plan to get vaccinated."

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#32

Could this also be a result of forced vaccinations on healthcare workers (who were on the front lines for us early in the pandemic) who then move to states without mandates.

Amazing how even raising this as a question gets you downvoted. Yes, I’m sure it’s a factor, and needlessly so considering the vaccine seems to have a negligible effect on transmission. Prepared for my own downvotes after sharing some particularly uncomfortable truths.

I'm not downvoting you, just pointing out that transmission isn't the only reason to be vaccinated in a hospital setting.

Hospital systems are already overwhelmed, so having vaccinated staff reduces the amount of staff that have to miss shifts because they are dealing with covid symptoms.

Vaccines reduce symptoms, death and hospitalizations from covid complications. It's amazing to me that we have hospital staff that would rather listen to the Joe Rogans of the world than to the science they supposedly learned about in college.

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#33
There are a few things I've learned from the nurses I know...

- Nurses, the primary caregivers in Hospitals, have been treated pretty poorly for a long time. Some of it is pay, some of it is expectations, some of it is just the way the people around them treat them (e.g., the way surgeons often talk to them).

- Some management has gotten down right mean. I know one hospital that has dictated that refusing to work a mandated shift (that's where they keep you longer than your shift to keep working) will cause you to be fired. They've gone through on that already.

- ICU nurses have seen the worst. In places that have had peak COVID it's not unusual for 9/10 people with COVID in the ICU to die. That takes a tole on people.

- Some hospitals are giving huge bonuses to new hires. And better pay. There's nothing like being a senior nurse in an ICU who has more responsibility and higher expectations while having the new person next to them having just gotten a bonus and making more money. You might as well quit and go work at a different nearby hospital to get a bonus and raise.

I wonder what would happen if hospitals starting doing peakon surveys of their people and started working to improve on things.

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#35
post #14

I find it a bit depressing that the "you need to change jobs to get raises" dynamic is being seen in hospitals now as well.

Take it with a grain of salt but I have seen a number of conversations about how hospital groups are applying raises. They take the bottom pay and they apply some dollar amount per year worked/experience. Seems to be wiping out more experienced employees raises.

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6267377

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#36
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but that's really where this article should be focusing. Hospitals are basically at the "We tried nothing and we are out of ideas!" The solution to a lot of nurse burnout is really pretty simple, increase their wages, hire more than the minimum of travel nurses so they aren't all working overtime.

Wages are orthogonal to burnout Burnout is a psychological factor

Both factors are crucial when retaining people.

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#39
post #33

There are a few things I've learned from the nurses I know... - Nurses, the primary caregivers in Hospitals, have been treated pretty poorly for a long time. Some of it is pay, some of it is expectations, some of it is just the way the people around them treat them (e.g., the way surgeons often talk to them). - Some management has gotten down right mean. I know one hospital that has dictated that refusing to work a m…

> (e.g., the way surgeons often talk to them)

To be fair, surgeons talk to everyone that way. I haven’t met a surgeon who didn’t talk down to other people. My theory is that you have to have a huge fucking ego to cut someone open and believe you’re going to make them better.

Re: Worn-out nurses hit the road for better pay, stressing hospital budgets, morale

#40
post #37

Maybe going from being labelled as a hero to "get vaccinated or you're a threat to public health" is not something that sits very well with people.

Well, sure.

A war hero becomes a bad guy if they keep shooting after the enemy surrenders, too. Context matters.

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