Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

newyorker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 51 posts

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#31

Post by giantg2 »

Hallucinaut wrote: post #25
hardwaregeek wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah or like an arm canister of oxygen. I get that the sport is supposed to be dangerous but we've taken dangerous sports and made them less dangerous before. It's not a huge loss.

Could end up like American Football though where concussion rates climb compared to rugby or league due to protective gear allowing bigger impacts. That is, people could end up pushing even further knowing they have the safety net but blacking out before they get to use it.

I can see it leading to bigger risks - good point. The idea behind this would be to auto deploy, so they wouldn't have to manually do it.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#32

Post by MrLeap »

saeranv wrote: post #11

Fascinating (and kind of depressing) that the "attention deconcentration" technique she used to become a world-class athlete was originally developed in Russia for people who held very boring jobs. > Molchanova’s technique for concentration was based on a procedure she called attention deconcentration. She said it came from ancient warriors and was used by samurai, and that in Russia it had been adapted and developed…

Looking up attention deconcentration sent me down a surprisingly short rabbit hole that in 2 steps ended at a wikipedia article for "psychonetics" -- which redirected to some guy whose name I've recognized from a few dubious things that have popped up on HN recently.

Baadar-meinhof I guess!

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#33

Post by giantg2 »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #30
giantg2 wrote: post #10

Sounds like tech could be used to increase safety. How about a mask with emergency oxygen that detects when you pass out and administers the oxygen? Maybe location beacons similar to tacking undersea animals?

Tech could certainly be used to increase safety, but there are major barriers to uptake. Blackout recovery vests have existed for decades and have essentially no ultilization. In freediving, minimalism and freedom are emphasized, so additional gear runs contrary to the central ethos. Regarding masks, the mouth and often nose are not covered to enhance the mammalian diving reflex. Many divers forgo goggles as well.

Thanks. I don't know very much about it. From the little I saw (years ago), it seemed like it was standard/common to at least have wetsuit, goggles, and dive belt. If I remember correctly, they even had safety divers stationed at various depths along the rope. Which I guess would make this mostly useless in actual competition.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#35

Post by s1artibartfast »

giantg2 wrote: post #33
s1artibartfast wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech could certainly be used to increase safety, but there are major barriers to uptake. Blackout recovery vests have existed for decades and have essentially no ultilization. In freediving, minimalism and freedom are emphasized, so additional gear runs contrary to the central ethos. Regarding masks, the mouth and often nose are not covered to enhance the mammalian diving reflex. Many divers forgo goggles as well.

Thanks. I don't know very much about it. From the little I saw (years ago), it seemed like it was standard/common to at least have wetsuit, goggles, and dive belt. If I remember correctly, they even had safety divers stationed at various depths along the rope. Which I guess would make this mostly useless in actual competition.

Most of the safety divers you see are stationed near the surface for ascent, which is the most risky part of a dive. There is simply no practical backup spotting at bottom, because divers go beyond the limits of scuba at the bottom of their dives.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#36

Post by ashtonkem »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #30
giantg2 wrote: post #10

Sounds like tech could be used to increase safety. How about a mask with emergency oxygen that detects when you pass out and administers the oxygen? Maybe location beacons similar to tacking undersea animals?

Tech could certainly be used to increase safety, but there are major barriers to uptake. Blackout recovery vests have existed for decades and have essentially no ultilization. In freediving, minimalism and freedom are emphasized, so additional gear runs contrary to the central ethos. Regarding masks, the mouth and often nose are not covered to enhance the mammalian diving reflex. Many divers forgo goggles as well.

There’s a selection effect going on here. Free divers tend to be a risk tolerant group inherently, which causes them to forgo safety equipment. Those who would want or even demand better safety standards don’t become free divers, because it’s too dangerous for them.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#37

Post by s1artibartfast »

ashtonkem wrote: post #36
s1artibartfast wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech could certainly be used to increase safety, but there are major barriers to uptake. Blackout recovery vests have existed for decades and have essentially no ultilization. In freediving, minimalism and freedom are emphasized, so additional gear runs contrary to the central ethos. Regarding masks, the mouth and often nose are not covered to enhance the mammalian diving reflex. Many divers forgo goggles as well.

There’s a selection effect going on here. Free divers tend to be a risk tolerant group inherently, which causes them to forgo safety equipment. Those who would want or even demand better safety standards don’t become free divers, because it’s too dangerous for them.

I think there is a fair bit of truth to that.

Freediving is also a very decentralized sport, so it is unclear how safety standards could even be implemented outside of the very niche competitive setting.

In comparison, SCUBA has a certification system and means of enforcement via tank, trip, and service providers.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#38

Post by niknoble »

Shouldn't the title read "World's greatest female free diver?" since her records are well below the mens' records?

Maybe they mean that, even though she doesn't have the best results in an absolute sense, she has achieved more than anyone relative to her potential. But if we're judging relative to potential, then we also have to consider all the people who pushed themselves to their limits but were not able to set any records due to physical limitations. Who is the best freediver less than 5 feet tall? Who is the best freediver with a naturally low lung capacity? And then the question seems silly, since we could never take all of these people into account.

I assume the title is intentionally provocative and provokes this question in almost every reader. But no one has mentioned it here, so I figured I would be the one to call it out explicitly.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#39

Post by s1artibartfast »

niknoble wrote: post #38

Shouldn't the title read "World's greatest female free diver?" since her records are well below the mens' records? Maybe they mean that, even though she doesn't have the best results in an absolute sense, she has achieved more than anyone relative to her potential. But if we're judging relative to potential, then we also have to consider all the people who pushed themselves to their limits but were not able to set an…

I think it is meant to be a subjective statement of opinion, as she no longer holds any depths records in the women's classes either.

Re: The disappearance of the world’s greatest free diver (2015)

#40

Post by spearo77 »

yesimahuman wrote: post #34

I've casually free dove all my life (not to any significant depth), and I was shocked to hear that blackouts can happen even at shallow depths. I definitely have a lot more respect for this sport and will avoid doing it alone in the future.

Shallow water blackout is a phenomenon that occurs when lungs expand while ascending from a deep dive. The contrast from deep to shallow is what's dangerous. Oxygen is rapidly pulled out of your bloodstream back into your lungs as they expand. It happens quickly (and unexpectedly if you're not already aware of it). Of course you can stay too long at a shallow depth, but that's a simple, predictable linear exhaustion of oxygen.
Post reply on HN