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Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

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Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#511

Post by mod »

throwawaywindev wrote: post #429
haberman wrote: post #415

I always thought it was strange that "integrated graphics" was, for years, was synonymous with "cheap, underperforming" compared to the power of a discrete GPU. I never could see any fundamental reason why "integrated" should mean "underpowered." Apple is turning things around, and is touting the benefits of high-performance integrated graphics.

Video game consoles have been using integrated graphics for at least 15 years now, since Playstation 3 and Xbox 360.

Yeah, and vendors like Bungie are forced to cap their framerates at 30fps (Destiny 2).

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#512

Post by peatmoss »

remir wrote: post #390
lisper wrote: post #105

"Apple’s Commitment to the Environment" > Today, Apple is carbon neutral for global corporate operations, and by 2030, plans to have net-zero climate impact across the entire business, which includes manufacturing supply chains and all product life cycles. This also means that every chip Apple creates, from design to manufacturing, will be 100 percent carbon neutral. But what they won't do is put the chip in an expan…

Isn’t most of the components in MacBooks recyclable? If I remember correctly, Apple has a recycling program for old Macs so it’s not like these machines goes to landfill when their past their time or broken.

I believe Apple tries to use mostly recyclable components. And they do have a fairly comprehensive set of recycling / trade-in programs around the globe: https://www.apple.com/recycling/nationalservices/

That being said, I haven’t read any third-party audits to know if this is more than Apple marketing. Would be curious if they live up to their own marketing.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#513

Post by terafo »

hajile wrote: post #462
SkeuomorphicBee wrote: post #443

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I never could see any fundamental reason why "integrated" should mean "underpowered." There was always one reason: limited memory bandwidth. You simply couldn't cram enough pins and traces for all the processor io plus a memory bus wide enough to feed a powerful GPU. (at least not in a reasonable price)

We solved that almost a decade ago now with HBM. Sure, the latencies aren't amazing, but the power consumption numbers are and large caches can hide the higher access latencies pretty well in almost all cases.

Only time that I can remember HBM being used with some kind of integrated graphics was strange Intel NUC with Vega GPU and IIRC correctly they were on the same die.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#514

Post by [deleted] »

lisper wrote: post #105

"Apple’s Commitment to the Environment" > Today, Apple is carbon neutral for global corporate operations, and by 2030, plans to have net-zero climate impact across the entire business, which includes manufacturing supply chains and all product life cycles. This also means that every chip Apple creates, from design to manufacturing, will be 100 percent carbon neutral. But what they won't do is put the chip in an expan…

[deleted]

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#515

Post by tedunangst »

lillecarl wrote: post #446
dragontamer wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Apple cores are full custom, Apple-only designs. The AWS Graviton are Neoverse cores, which are pretty good, but clearly these Apple-only M1 cores are above-and-beyond. --------- That being said: these M1 cores (and Neoverse cores) are missing SMT / Hyperthreading, and a few other features I'd expect in a server product. Servers are fine with the bandwidth/latency tradeoff: more (better) bandwidth but at worse (h…

My understanding is that you don't really need hyperthreading on a RISC CPU because decoding instructions is easier and doesn't have to be parallelised as with hyperthreading.

Hyper threading has nothing to do with instruction decode. It's for hiding memory latency. The sparc T line is 8 way threaded.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#516

Post by barelysapient »

hajile wrote: post #331
skohan wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a tradeoff in terms of power consumption?

In A15, Anandtech claims the Efficiency cores are 1/3 the performance, but 1/10 the power. They should be looking at (effectively) doubling the power consumption over M1 with just the CPUs and assuming they don't increase clockspeeds. Going from 8 to 16 or 32 GPU cores is another massive power increase.

I wonder if Apple will give us a 'long-haul' mode where the system is locked to only the energy efficient cores and settings. I us developer types would love a computer that survives 24 hours on battery.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#517

Post by modulusshift »

mlindner wrote: post #437
ksec wrote: post #362

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of Hardware M1 Max is great. On paper you wont find anything match its performance under load. As even Gaming / Content Creation Laptop throttle after a short while. The problem is gaming isn't exactly a Mac thing. From Game selection to general support on the platform. So really performance should be the least of your concern if you are buying a Mac for games.

I'm not aware of a single even semi-major game (including popular indie titles) that run native on M1 yet. Everything is running under Rosetta and game companies so far seem completely uninterested in native support.

Disco Elysium, EVE Online, Minecraft*, Timberborn, Total War: Rome Remastered, World of Warcraft.

Minecraft is kinda cheating, because Java, and even considering that it takes a bit of hacking. Alternatively you can sideload the iOS version.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#518

Post by [deleted] »

throwawaywindev wrote: post #429
haberman wrote: post #415

I always thought it was strange that "integrated graphics" was, for years, was synonymous with "cheap, underperforming" compared to the power of a discrete GPU. I never could see any fundamental reason why "integrated" should mean "underpowered." Apple is turning things around, and is touting the benefits of high-performance integrated graphics.

Video game consoles have been using integrated graphics for at least 15 years now, since Playstation 3 and Xbox 360.

[deleted]

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#519

Post by cmckn »

jb1991 wrote: post #495
soheil wrote: post #482

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't you buy a MBP 16" and connect it to whatever display you were going to connect your Mac Mini to?

But there’s a huge difference in the price if you don’t need all the other stuff that comes with the MacBook Pro.

Agreed, and the mini has different I/O that you might prefer (USB-A, 10 gig eth). Also, it’s smaller (surprise, “mini”). Plus, clamshell mode on a MacBook just isn’t the same as a desktop for “always-on” use cases.

Re: Apple’s new M1 Pro and M1 Max processors

#520

Post by iSnow »

klelatti wrote: post #183
wmf wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, it'll be the same M1 Max. Just wait a few months like with the 24" iMac.

You're probably right. Maybe they have inventory to work through!

They also have a limited headcount and resources so they wouldn't want to announce M1x/pro/max for all machines now and have employees be idle for the next 3 months.

Notebooks also have a higher profit margin, so they sell them to those who need to upgrade now. The lower-margin systems like Mini will come later. And the Mac Pro will either die or come with the next iteration of the chips.

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