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PinePhone Pro Announced

pine64.org

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Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#231

Post by TobTobXX »

treesknees wrote: post #60
rich_sasha wrote: post #30

Honest question: what is the path to something resembling wider-audience usability (i.e. not a toy project)? Or is that not really a plan? I'd LOVE an open, Linux-based phone. But I also need a phone that does video calls, has a working browser, messenger etc. One that works with at least a good bunch of most common apps. Is that likely to ever happen? Or is this a very interesting project, but really aimed at tinker…

Never say never, but I'm not optimistic for it. The biggest issue is app compatibility. Even with a huge budget and namesake like Microsoft Windows, you can see how Microsoft's mobile OS projects have essentially disappeared when trying to compete against iOS and Android. Maybe someone will get Android apps running natively on a Linux distro, but then you're still missing the unlicensed framework around Google Play t…

> Maybe someone will get Android apps running natively on a Linux distro

Depending on what you mean by 'native', you might find Waydroid[0] interesting. It only does containerization, not emulation.

And also: While yes, Linux on the desktop isn't too successful, it is at a state that you can daily drive with it for all tasks. Maybe you won't get the MS Office suite running, but there are alternatives.

I think the Linux mobile niche will go into the same direction. It won't be successful, if measured by raw numbers, but it will be successful in that it will provide a functional alternative for those willing to do it. It won't ever run WhatsApp, but it will run usable alternatives.

> Depending on what you mean by 'native', you might find Waydroid[0] interesting. It only does containerization, not emulation.

[0]: https://github.com/waydroid/waydroid

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#232

Post by josteink »

idle_zealot wrote: post #84
reginold wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Similar experience with a new PinePhone last week but different conclusion. PinePhone is our only hope. It's still in Beta, months or years from being consumer ready. And that's just where it needs to be from a development standpoint. Don't rush. That said, reading your comment I also wonder about having too many distros of Linux going after PinePhone. I had an SD card with I believe 14 distros. Doesn't that mean the…

> Doesn't that mean the core development is divided 14 times? I don’t think it’s quite that simple. A lot of these competing mobile distros are using and working on the same libraries and porting desktop applications to mobile in similar ways. The biggest differences are usually the desktop distro that they’ve made their base and their desktop environment of choice. It’s common to see enhancements to an application o…

> I’ll also throw in an honorable mention of sxmo and its wayland port, which I consider the equivalent to the underdog tiling window managers on the desktop; which is to say its only option good enough to consider using.

It’s a funny thing indeed.

sxmo seems to be the only option not focusing on competing with Apple and Google on a “good enough for mainstream” ux.

I mean Phosh is nice and all. Having frameworks for contacts and calendars just like in Gnome is nice. Pulseaudio working just as on the desktop is great too. But the total experience still leaves the impression of a very subpar iOS/Android copy.

sxmo though, that has decided to not compete with Apple and Google on what they do best, but rather do their own thing and re-envision what a Linux smartphone should/could be.

And I like it. I like it a lot. It’s by far my favourite Linux smart-phone experience so far.

I just need a better phone to run it on, and the Pinephone Pro could be that phone.

New phone or not, I’d also appreciate if sxmo managed to rebase on/ship for Mobian too. The package selection for pmOS and Alpine is pretty weak in comparison.

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#233

Post by liendolucas »

I've recently ordered a PinePhone. At 200 bucks I consider it a donation. I encourage other people to also buy one, even if it is not what you expect. This along the Framework laptops is definitely the way to think about consumer products. I wish appliances were also manufactured open source. Imagine fridges, microwaves, toasters, etc. Things that you can open, understand and learn from and maybe eventually build your own thing if you have the will and time to do so.

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#234

Post by TobTobXX »

dleslie wrote: post #35

They seem to have fixed my personal gripe with the PinePhone: the camera was terrible.

I think most of the limitation might actually lie in software. I have a CE and Megapixels (the camera app I'm using) can store raw files and the raw files and the processed jpg files have a significant gap in quality.

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#235

Post by TobTobXX »

systemvoltage wrote: post #91

I want to see a radically different approach to Phone user interfaces. It's just the same cookie cutter trends from Apple and Google.

Take a look at sxmo[0]. It is inspired by the niche of tiling window managers and shortcut-driven workflow. I don't know if it is your style, but it qualifies as radiaclly different.

[0]: https://sxmo.org/

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#236

Post by bluGill »

robbedpeter wrote: post #218
djent wrote: post #163

It is frustrating to me that despite the blunt verbiage about it being a beta device for software and hardware developers, people even here are griping about it being not ready for everyday use. If a free and open-source mobile operating system is missing software support for a feature you want, please contribute to its development.

How many hundreds or thousands of enthusiasts are needed before it's suitable to be a daily driver? I see the fragmented approach on the software side as a major hindrance to the goal of achieving a device that can be used by a normal person as a reasonable replacement for other smart phones. I check in on it every l every 6 months or so, update my pinephone and give it a few days. So far, it doesn't meet reliability…

> How many hundreds or thousands of enthusiasts are needed before it's suitable to be a daily driver?

Zero. What is needed is a few hundred developers writing actually code to make it useful. The enthusiasts are at best nice to haves. You can blur the line if you write good bug reports, but right now the pinephone doesn't need end users.

The above will change over time. Millions of users would be enough to force carriers to support activating it on their network, something that developers cannot do (at least not legally). Likewise large numbers of users would be enough to those banking apps written. However today millions of users wouldn't make any difference to the important parts of making it work (except in so far as users sometimes become developers)

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#237

Post by bluGill »

mixmastamyk wrote: post #224
djent wrote: post #163

It is frustrating to me that despite the blunt verbiage about it being a beta device for software and hardware developers, people even here are griping about it being not ready for everyday use. If a free and open-source mobile operating system is missing software support for a feature you want, please contribute to its development.

Unfortunately I'm fully booked, and would gladly pay an extra hundred or two for someone else to do it. Not clear on who that is yet.

Unless you are talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars though your money isn't really useful. Developers are on the higher end of the income curve and so few people alone can afford to hire them like that. You can donate a few hundred so several projects, it will make a difference, but thousands of other people need to do the same before they can hire even one person (and the first people hired will do more IT or administrative work that needs to be done)

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#238

Post by DeathArrow »

marcellus23 wrote: post #201
unexpected wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like programmers have become "soft". I bet the old guard is okay with something like this - a lot of C, C++, assembly skills - this is what it meant to mess around with computers! Now, you can just be modifying CSS and call yourself a programmer. You get one of these devices, and you're sorely disappointed!

> a lot of C, C++, assembly skills - this is what it meant to mess around with computers! I can't believe this is getting upvoted on HN. What kind of gatekeeping elitist bullshit is this?

What's elitist in learning a craft properly? Working with a higher level language doesn't mean that learning C, C++, algorithms, data structures and a bit of math isn't terrible useful.

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#239

Post by DeathArrow »

twis wrote: post #185
unexpected wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like programmers have become "soft". I bet the old guard is okay with something like this - a lot of C, C++, assembly skills - this is what it meant to mess around with computers! Now, you can just be modifying CSS and call yourself a programmer. You get one of these devices, and you're sorely disappointed!

The pool of programmers has grown. There are more good programmers than ever, but the barrier to entry is also lower. It isn't necessary to pass through that kind of trial by fire anymore.

Yeah, the barrier is lower, many people can write Electron apps now.

Re: PinePhone Pro Announced

#240

Post by rjsw »

justinclift wrote: post #228

You've got to be frigging kidding. Literally just received a PinePhone earlier this week. And now it's obsolete? Not happy at all. :(

I don't consider the original PinePhone obsolete, I'm still planning to get one at some point even after the announcement today.

Suspect you can sell your one on to someone if you want.

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