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Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

news.ycombinator.com

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Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#141

Post by mStreamTeam »

ivank wrote: post #102
mStreamTeam wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone with ADHD, I can confirm this model is super predatory. I cancel all my credit cards every year just to get rid of all opt-in charges on regular basis

Canceling a credit card does not cancel your obligation to pay a vendor unless you also terminate your plan with them. Some of them will try to collect, especially if you had a contract.

Sometimes I go through my bill and find opt-in services so I can call in charge backs against them before I cancel.

They can pry that money out of my cold dead hands. And I've yet to have anything sent to collections

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#142

Post by sebisaacsinflow »

skeletron wrote: post #123
sebisaacsinflow wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the follow-up questions. We're actually working on several different sign-ups flows at the moment including opt-in post free trial, longer free trial, web sign-up and one-off purchase vs subscription. It is not our intention to push annual significantly over monthly - we wanted to give a significant discount to yearly subscribers but perhaps the difference between the two is too large. The previously menti…

Thanks, it's good to know that you're considering alternatives. As you have a number of people with ADHD working on your app, I would be curious to know if any of them raised concerns about these specifics of your subscription model, during planning and development of the app?

As well as input from the team, we did a lot of user interviews and testing during development and this wasn't flagged as a concern (a lot of people were used to the model from other apps) but clearly this is something we need to work on.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#143

Post by krono »

dragonwriter wrote: post #106
krono wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The massive difference that you are overlooking, however, is the fact that ADHD Brains are neurologically and/or biochemically incapable of defense against this. That inner voice telling you what to do or what not to do? ADHD brains have... well, let's just say "something else".. in its place.

> That inner voice telling you what to do or what not to do? ADHD brains have... well, let's just say "something else".. in its place. Pretty much every description I’ve heard from people diagnosed with ADHD features the same kind of internal voice as neurotypical people describe; the “something else” seems to be between that voice and action, not in place of it.

I'm diagnosed with severe combined type ADHD (top tier, best of both worlds) which could have something to do with this, but I can't say I have ever thought of this voice and action/driver as separate things.

My natural, pre-treatment, and unmedicated sub-/semi-conscious behaviour is not at all like that of a typical person.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#144

Post by samhw »

mStreamTeam wrote: post #128
samhw wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you propose that they feed and house themselves? Has someone got a GitHub repo for that?

They can get a real job instead of making products that prey on people with ADHD. There's no job shortage, so don't make excuses for them

My point is about the unbelievably privileged attitude of "you should make products for me free of charge, or else you're the greedy one". Not whether this specific product should exist, which is a different point from how it should be funded.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#145

Post by brainwipe »

skeletron wrote: post #22

Many of the reviews of the Android app are quite critical of the trial and payment model, for example: > CAUTION: After the free trial period (7 days), they will charge for an annual subscription ($102.95 US). This is OPT OUT, not opt in. In other reviews they say they will offer a refund (I will update when/if I get one) but for an app for people with executive function issues, an opt out format seems shady. Either…

Given that executive dysfunction is one facet of ADHD/ADD, having opt-out is definitely preying on the users. Avoid.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#146

Post by sebisaacsinflow »

mStreamTeam wrote: post #128
samhw wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you propose that they feed and house themselves? Has someone got a GitHub repo for that?

They can get a real job instead of making products that prey on people with ADHD. There's no job shortage, so don't make excuses for them

If we didn't build and charge for our app then we can't continue working on it and improving. We enable many people to get support they wouldn't be able to otherwise and significantly broaden accessibility compared to medication and in-person therapy. We're not a non-profit but we do need to improve our model.

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#148

Post by mStreamTeam »

samhw wrote: post #144
mStreamTeam wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can get a real job instead of making products that prey on people with ADHD. There's no job shortage, so don't make excuses for them

My point is about the unbelievably privileged attitude of "you should make products for me free of charge, or else you're the greedy one". Not whether this specific product should exist, which is a different point from how it should be funded.

You're using quotes but I never said those words. Never speak on my behalf again. It's insulting.

I don't want them to do it for free. I want then to not make a predatory product. I want them to make their money through a more honest business

And if they can't do that, I want them to do nothing

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#149

Post by carlisle_ »

colinplamondon wrote: post #139
carlisle_ wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it strange that you keep talking past the point people are making. The problem is opt-out, and nobody is holding this company to a different standard. People hate opt-out, and in this case it looks particularly predatory. Your comments come off as entirely unempathetic. Not everything is about bottom line capitalism.

I'm entirely and completely unemphatic. I think these are loser concerns for when a startup first launches. These guys are moving the needle making improvements in a forward direction, and a big part of this thread is shitting on their launch, hyper-focusing on things they'll be able to change. Launch HN threads used to be about asking thoughtful questions, having a back and forth where people learn about new spaces,…

What kind of virtue signaling is congratulating a startup for their innovation before they've proven anything?

Also the word is "empathy" not "emphatic".

Re: Launch HN: Inflow (YC S21) – Self-help app for people with ADHD

#150

Post by PragmaticPulp »

DaveSchmindel wrote: post #109

Disclaimer: I really appreciate the mission statement here. As someone who suspects they are impacted by some sort of undiagnosed ADD/ADHD, it's really great to know I'm not alone in these thoughts and that there are people trying to make solutions for it. That said, while everyone is up in arms about the payment model here, I'm more concerned with the nature of the app's content. What I was expecting to be an intera…

> turned out to be a whole bunch of audio recordings and generic goal-setting form fields. I almost laughed when I was creating my first goal, because in the introduction video by the cofounder he makes a point to explain that, "Like many of you, I've invested in planners and organizers hoping that they would magically help me become more productive."

This is a huge red flag for any self-help app.

Therapists should never try to build a dependency upon the therapist, yet it appears this app is structured to do just that: Convince users that external tools won't work for them, then capture their activity inside of an app with an expensive annual fee.

The purpose of therapy should be to give users the tools to support themselves. For example, showing users how to use traditional organizers in ways that are more compatible with their conditions and building a system of reminders and automatic habits to support that goal.

The incentive structure of this app is inherently in conflict with the traditional goal of therapy: Self-sufficiency.

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