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Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

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71–80 of 367 posts

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#71
post #66
post #5

I'm sure this guy knew what he was doing - but yes, he was probably coerced or induced by someone with more authority. There's no way the buck stops there.

"he was probably coerced or induced by someone with more authority" Then he should flip. Naming names will at least buy some sympathy points.

How? If there's no evidence of a conversation, it won't help his case.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#73
post #70
post #65

While I don't have any sympathy for this pilot, I also find the FAA's excuses here to be less than convincing. Basically, their position is "Well, we trusted this Boeing employee to tell us the truth about the new flight controls, and he didn't." But if the regulators had actually done their job and independently evaluated the new flight controls, they wouldn't have had to take the word of any Boeing employees. I rea…

At some point, auditors have to trust some things that their subjects are saying. If the auditor has to re-evaluate every piece of information, they will end up re-doing the subjects' jobs.

There's a bit of backstory here where things the auditors used to verify first hand devolved into from-a-distance. And too friendly a relationship with the businesses they were auditing.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#74
At the end of the day we need some dummy to be hanged at the town square. So we can all lie to ourselves justice was served and everything works as should.

There are entire generations of people inside that company that should at least sit their asses in court.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#75
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately it looks like this is really a fall guy with no mention of where the instruction to hide this information came from. On the other hand, according to his Linkedin Mark Forkner worked for the FAA before moving to Boeing to become the chief technical pilot, so he should have been well aware of the stakes when he hid information.

This is the C suite guy getting the charges levied on him with pretty solid evidence against him. if he wants to avoid long term jail they will use him to cut a deal to get more information to find out if any of the few people that are above him ordered him to do it.

I think this comment points out that this may not be accurate https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28873133

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#76
post #71
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"he was probably coerced or induced by someone with more authority" Then he should flip. Naming names will at least buy some sympathy points.

How? If there's no evidence of a conversation, it won't help his case.

It does point some heat at the named person, and maybe drags their name through the mud.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#77
post #5

I'm sure this guy knew what he was doing - but yes, he was probably coerced or induced by someone with more authority. There's no way the buck stops there.

Unless he flips on management there’s not much for the government to go on. And then you’re asking a jury to believe the words of someone already alleged to be dishonest.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#78
post #70
post #65

While I don't have any sympathy for this pilot, I also find the FAA's excuses here to be less than convincing. Basically, their position is "Well, we trusted this Boeing employee to tell us the truth about the new flight controls, and he didn't." But if the regulators had actually done their job and independently evaluated the new flight controls, they wouldn't have had to take the word of any Boeing employees. I rea…

At some point, auditors have to trust some things that their subjects are saying. If the auditor has to re-evaluate every piece of information, they will end up re-doing the subjects' jobs.

And that's how we got the VAG emissions scandal. Instead of trusting computer outputs, we could have done tried and true dyno tests and the entire thing would have been avoided.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not know if these discussions happened in WA, but WA had one party consent audio recording laws instead of all party consent, then executives would be more wary of instructing underlings to do something illegal.

Are there any downsides to this?

None that I have been able to come up with. Two or more party consent audio recording laws only serve to provide people with power more protection.

Re: Former Boeing 737 Max Chief Technical Pilot Indicted for Fraud

#80
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

to calibrate our hopes we can just look at VW dieselgate

The CEO at the time, Martin Winterkor, and at least six other executives were indicted. Some of the executives were jailed but still not the CEO (I can find mentions of prosecutors discussing the sentence but no mention of him actually starting serving it). But I have muche less hope in the capacity of the US to seriously incriminate its poster child.

The CEO Martin Winterkorn is German and Germany doesn't extradite their citizens outside the EU so nothing will happen there. According to Wikipedia, he was also charged in Germany but looks like he will walk free from most charges.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Winterkorn#United_State...

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