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OpenBSD 7.0

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Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#131

Post by na85 »

epitactic wrote: post #105
mirekrusin wrote: post #90

I'd love to try but I'm experiencing hardcore option paralysis every time I start thinking about it. FreeBSD, OpenBSD or NetBSD – _that_ is the question. Wait, maybe DragonFly actually? illumos? ...wait, I mean OpenIndiana, I think... wait, what's OmniOS? Is Darwin a thing, like I could just have BSD and macOS for free or something?

This is why I've setup my homelab with a hypervisor, you don't have to choose and can run each of these operating systems, for specific purposes they are best suited for. This is what I do: OpenIndiana: file server (ZFS) OpenBSD: firewall, router, network services (DHCP, DNS, NAT) DragonflyBSD: game server FreeBSD: other general application services I haven't found a personal use case for NetBSD yet, though I would l…

Which games are you hosting on dragonfly, and is the performance actually better than freebsd?

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#132

Post by amatecha »

puffyn wrote: post #101
nanna wrote: post #6

Any BSD fans out there wish to persuade a happy Debian desktop user to take a BSD for a spin?

I can only comment on OpenBSD. It’s a minimal unix system. I like the minimalism. OpenBSD is mainly a router/server/firewall system but you can use OpenBSD on a desktop. If your hardware is supported everything works out of the box. Firefox/Chromium have pledge/unveil security which prevent them from accessing your file system. Something like apparmor but works put of the box. However it’s not designed as a desktop s…

There is virtualization with vmm: https://www.openbsd.org/faq/faq16.html

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#133

Post by kazen44 »

chousuke wrote: post #119
mirekrusin wrote: post #90

I'd love to try but I'm experiencing hardcore option paralysis every time I start thinking about it. FreeBSD, OpenBSD or NetBSD – _that_ is the question. Wait, maybe DragonFly actually? illumos? ...wait, I mean OpenIndiana, I think... wait, what's OmniOS? Is Darwin a thing, like I could just have BSD and macOS for free or something?

I recommend giving OpenBSD a try over the others. It's just... a clean OS, and the base system is extremely well documented; to the point that I think it's the only OS you can learn inside out without ever using Google. OpenBSD might not be the best choice for any given use, but it's so remarkably consistent and understandable that I think everyone interested in alternative OSes should try it out at least once.

OpenBSD has been the OS with the lowest amount of maintenance in my opinion.

used it as a webserver and VPN appliance for a couple of years now.

only thing in terms of maintenance is the following when a new release is released.

pkg_add -u ( i usually update extra packages every 6 months, which is mainly lets encrypt). syspatch sysupgrade

reboot:

after reboot

sysmerge to see if i need to do a config diff.

Has been rocksolid and very future rich in base aswell.

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#135

Post by t-3 »

mirekrusin wrote: post #90

I'd love to try but I'm experiencing hardcore option paralysis every time I start thinking about it. FreeBSD, OpenBSD or NetBSD – _that_ is the question. Wait, maybe DragonFly actually? illumos? ...wait, I mean OpenIndiana, I think... wait, what's OmniOS? Is Darwin a thing, like I could just have BSD and macOS for free or something?

OpenBSD for laptops, VM guests, and VPSs. It has a very coherent userland, and the devs dogfood heavily, my go-to for anything I have to actually administer.

FreeBSD for servers and NAS, desktop. FreeBSD has high performance all around, ZFS, jails, bhyve, linux compatability, etc. But it's not as nice to administer as OpenBSD. I want to love it, but it's tedious.

NetBSD is an OK choice for anything, and very capable, but doesn't stand out for anything other than portability. If you enjoy hacking on things, you might find a lot of use in it.

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#136

Post by melony »

chousuke wrote: post #119
mirekrusin wrote: post #90

I'd love to try but I'm experiencing hardcore option paralysis every time I start thinking about it. FreeBSD, OpenBSD or NetBSD – _that_ is the question. Wait, maybe DragonFly actually? illumos? ...wait, I mean OpenIndiana, I think... wait, what's OmniOS? Is Darwin a thing, like I could just have BSD and macOS for free or something?

I recommend giving OpenBSD a try over the others. It's just... a clean OS, and the base system is extremely well documented; to the point that I think it's the only OS you can learn inside out without ever using Google. OpenBSD might not be the best choice for any given use, but it's so remarkably consistent and understandable that I think everyone interested in alternative OSes should try it out at least once.

I don't want a OS where I have to read man pages and documentation to get around. The whole self documentation excuse is the same reason why Emacs is slowly losing market share. People want software that is intuitive, and failing that, have all answers available on their favorite search engine. Short of baking a chatbot or search engine into OpenBSD, relying purely on self documentation is not sustainable. Though the idea of Clippy being powered by GPT3 does sound appealing.

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#137

Post by [deleted] »

nix23 wrote: post #84
noja wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was referring not to the content of the comment, but the wording of its delivery.

That one? >>They should take a page out of Microsoft's book here. or mine? >You should have known that before installing at your customers site en masse. Sorry for stating a fact that you should know your OS before sprinkle it all over your customers.

[deleted]

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#138

Post by [deleted] »

nix23 wrote: post #84
noja wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was referring not to the content of the comment, but the wording of its delivery.

That one? >>They should take a page out of Microsoft's book here. or mine? >You should have known that before installing at your customers site en masse. Sorry for stating a fact that you should know your OS before sprinkle it all over your customers.

[deleted]

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#139

Post by [deleted] »

ninjin wrote: post #70
noja wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

^^ The wording of this response represents exactly why many people don't choose OpenBSD.

Yes, but you say that as if it was a universally bad thing. OpenBSD is largely made by its developers, for its developers. It has its own unique culture and does not seek mass appeal. To many – such as myself – this is refreshing, in particular when you contrast it to how poor open source developers are scolded on GitHub by entitled users for not putting in more of their free labour to satisfy their requirements. Is…

[deleted]

Re: OpenBSD 7.0

#140

Post by lcall »

melony wrote: post #136
chousuke wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recommend giving OpenBSD a try over the others. It's just... a clean OS, and the base system is extremely well documented; to the point that I think it's the only OS you can learn inside out without ever using Google. OpenBSD might not be the best choice for any given use, but it's so remarkably consistent and understandable that I think everyone interested in alternative OSes should try it out at least once.

I don't want a OS where I have to read man pages and documentation to get around. The whole self documentation excuse is the same reason why Emacs is slowly losing market share. People want software that is intuitive, and failing that, have all answers available on their favorite search engine. Short of baking a chatbot or search engine into OpenBSD, relying purely on self documentation is not sustainable. Though the…

You can still use search engines, but once you learn your way around the documentation, you might find it is more reliable and quicker.

To me, it seems worthwhile to have fewer 0-day bugs to worry about, and more reliable separation between user accounts (fewer privilege escalation bugs, etc etc). (I also recommend setting default umask to 0077 for the same reason, except while using pkg_add -- I have a wrapper script that undoes it temporarily for that due to issues encountered.)

There are reasons people use Windows or Apple (perceived convenience), and reasons not to (long-term cost/benefit decisions for known uses).

In case it becomes useful to anyone: One way to traverse the docs is (occasionally helpful) is using something like http://man.bsd.lv/ for OBSD docs, like putting in an "=" (w/o quotes) in the search field then clicking "apropos" shows all the commands -- a useful way to learn "what is available in the base system"; or doing full-text searches (can be learned locally, I have an awkward script for it if needed),

(Edit: s/what is available/what is available in the base system/ .)

And: I find the ~"only 2 remote holes in the default install since about 1996" to be very impressive.

Edit: Another way to look at it might be by priorities. I have come to see priorities of some systems roughly as:

OpenBSD: security, openness, correctness (including of documentation), portability.

Linux: features, performance, openness, breadth of everything, compatibility, convenience (distributions vary in specifics of course; debian and/or devuan continue to impress me in their own way).

FreeBSD: performance, stability, openness.

NetBSD: portability, stability?, maybe enjoyment for its developers, openness. (I know least here.)

Windows / Apple: profitability while targeting preferences of specific groups who want different specific kinds of convenience, it seems.

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