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COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

jamesdysonaward.org

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Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#51

Post by krageon »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #47
krageon wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your relationship balance and trust is based on whether or not your partner can secretly make babies with you without your consent, that is something to be addressed (in a human way, not by using ultrasound on your testicles).

Relationships are hard and often imperfect. People often lie and act irrationally. I've seen justifications like "he won't leave me if I have a baby with him". As men, this is absolutely something that we should worry about.

They are hard and can be imperfect. More importantly, you cannot have a good relationship founded on this kind of thinking:

> People often lie and act irrationally.

If that is your fundamental truth in interacting with your partner(s), your relationships will never really get anywhere. It is just not good advice to tell people to do so, unless you want them to never create meaningful connections with their partners.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#52

Post by FooBarBizBazz »

dingdongbing wrote: post #27
clarkevans wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why must women must be the ones that compromise by having a medical intervention? Don't they also have the right to be "squeamish" about having an IUD or their hormones altered?

Use condoms. >don't they get the right to be squeamish about having an IUD or their hormones altered? IUD exist without any hormones, and taking hormones generally are safe and extemely well tested. Saying "hormones altered" shows your bias, and you don't think blasting your balls with heat "alters" your hormones? Certainly men who get vasectomies produce less testosterone.

> Saying "hormones altered" shows your bias

What is "Shows your bias" supposed to mean here? Look: There are women who don't like hormonal birth control. They feel bloated &etc. Trust me on this.

> IUD exist without any hormones

Yes, and theoretically and by the numbers it's effective, but did you know that it hurts to put one in? It's actually not a small ask. If a woman chooses it herself without prompting, fine. And in the context of a really long term relationship where you can "have a conversation", maybe. But it's not a little thing. In fact, it hurts enough that it can create a fair amount of resentment.

> you don't think blasting your balls with heat "alters" your hormones?

Actually no, that's not the mechanism at work here.

> Use condoms.

Well, that's reasonable advice, though you still do want to use multiple methods.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#53

Post by dingdongbing »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #49
dingdongbing wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finally a real answer, and not an increase of 2% chance of blood clots for a certain type of contraceptive pill. But this doesn't make a difference either because now the man can stop going to the ball blasting session. The main issue is trust, and why are you having unprotected sex with people you don't trust in the first place?

> But this doesn't make a difference either because now the man can stop going to the ball blasting session. It makes a huge difference. Actually it changes everything. With male birth control, there are 4 possible outcomes: 1. Man and woman don't use birth control. Conception is likely. 2. Man uses birth control. Woman doesn't. Conception is unlikely. 3. Man doesn't use birth control. Woman does. Conception is unlik…

What kind of relationship do you think you're building without any trust and explicitly telling your partner you don't trust her by both of you using contraceptives?

Let the fairer sex have some power

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#54

Post by iSnow »

dgfitz wrote: post #10
iSnow wrote: post #3

I see a couple of acceptance problems with the device. First, men a notoriously squeamish when it comes to their testicles. "Heating" without telling the temperature won't fly with many. I guess it doesn't have to be hot as it probably only needs to be warm enough to relax the cremaster muscles. If it has to be uncomfortably hot, I see little chance in the market. Second, I'd expect the ultrasound to hurt. The epidid…

> First, men a notoriously squeamish when it comes to their testicles. That's quite an inaccurate blanket statement. > Second, I'd expect the ultrasound to hurt. Ultrasound treatments are actually used to treat pain. Maybe you have evidence of ultrasounds causing pain, but I can't find anything of the sort. > Third, it will feel like gambling as the female partner doesn't really know whether all sperm is killed or wh…

>Maybe you have evidence of ultrasounds causing pain

Anecdotally, I had an ultrasound years ago and it was most certainly uncomfortable. The body of the testicles was fine, but moving over the epididymis wasn't that great.

And no, no inflammation or anything.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#55

Post by matheusmoreira »

dingdongbing wrote: post #53
matheusmoreira wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But this doesn't make a difference either because now the man can stop going to the ball blasting session. It makes a huge difference. Actually it changes everything. With male birth control, there are 4 possible outcomes: 1. Man and woman don't use birth control. Conception is likely. 2. Man uses birth control. Woman doesn't. Conception is unlikely. 3. Man doesn't use birth control. Woman does. Conception is unlik…

What kind of relationship do you think you're building without any trust and explicitly telling your partner you don't trust her by both of you using contraceptives? Let the fairer sex have some power

> What kind of relationship do you think you're building without any trust and explicitly telling your partner you don't trust her by both of you using contraceptives?

One where I don't end up with children I didn't plan to have.

> Let the fairer sex have some power

They do have the power to prevent conception. That's nice.

They should not have the power to have our children without our consent. The reasons for this should be obvious to anyone. I'm honestly surprised it's not considered rape.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#56

Post by dingdongbing »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #52
dingdongbing wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Use condoms. >don't they get the right to be squeamish about having an IUD or their hormones altered? IUD exist without any hormones, and taking hormones generally are safe and extemely well tested. Saying "hormones altered" shows your bias, and you don't think blasting your balls with heat "alters" your hormones? Certainly men who get vasectomies produce less testosterone.

> Saying "hormones altered" shows your bias What is "Shows your bias" supposed to mean here? Look: There are women who don't like hormonal birth control. They feel bloated &etc. Trust me on this. > IUD exist without any hormones Yes, and theoretically and by the numbers it's effective, but did you know that it hurts to put one in? It's actually not a small ask. If a woman chooses it herself without prompting, fine. A…

We have tested methods of birth control for women. We have untested and/or not as effective and/or not as safe methods for men. These methods also alter your hormones, the testicles are where the male hormones are produced. (We also have condoms guys)

The "important problem" should be to have _even safer_ birth control, not male birth control.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#57

Post by gambiting »

dingdongbing wrote: post #50
gambiting wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>The main issue is trust, and why are you having unprotected sex with people you don't trust in the first place? I guess you never had a condom break? As rare as it is, it happens.

Actually I've had it happen quite a few times, but it's been my own fault every time either for using condoms that were too thin or the wrong size when I first started using condoms or being drunk when putting them on.

Right, as you yourself admit - it has nothing to do with trust. You can absolutely trust or not trust someone, and a condom can still break, maybe because you made a mistake, maybe for some other reason, but trust isn't the "main" issue.

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#58

Post by dingdongbing »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #55
dingdongbing wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What kind of relationship do you think you're building without any trust and explicitly telling your partner you don't trust her by both of you using contraceptives? Let the fairer sex have some power

> What kind of relationship do you think you're building without any trust and explicitly telling your partner you don't trust her by both of you using contraceptives? One where I don't end up with children I didn't plan to have. > Let the fairer sex have some power They do have the power to prevent conception. That's nice. They should not have the power to have our children without our consent. The reasons for this…

Maybe abstinence is more your thing

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#59

Post by dingdongbing »

gambiting wrote: post #57
dingdongbing wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually I've had it happen quite a few times, but it's been my own fault every time either for using condoms that were too thin or the wrong size when I first started using condoms or being drunk when putting them on.

Right, as you yourself admit - it has nothing to do with trust. You can absolutely trust or not trust someone, and a condom can still break, maybe because you made a mistake, maybe for some other reason, but trust isn't the "main" issue.

This guy was talking about female contraceptions, not condoms

Re: COSO, an ultrasound-based and reversible approach to male contraception

#60

Post by matheusmoreira »

krageon wrote: post #51
matheusmoreira wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Relationships are hard and often imperfect. People often lie and act irrationally. I've seen justifications like "he won't leave me if I have a baby with him". As men, this is absolutely something that we should worry about.

They are hard and can be imperfect. More importantly, you cannot have a good relationship founded on this kind of thinking: > People often lie and act irrationally. If that is your fundamental truth in interacting with your partner(s), your relationships will never really get anywhere. It is just not good advice to tell people to do so, unless you want them to never create meaningful connections with their partners.

My experiences with relationships are overwhelmingly positive. However, there's always a non-zero risk that such a maneuver can happen. I've seen it happen, many times. Even in otherwise happy couples. Are you willing to bet your future on it?
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