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Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

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Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#71

Post by krrrh »

Lots of comments dismissing this out of hand because of lack of evidence, but there aren’t any conventional treatments that are very helpful for Alzheimer’s. The lifestyle adjustments suggested in the protocol are largely healthy, not that hard to do, and offer other health benefits. They are also relatively uncommon so it’s not impossible that a broad based adoption of specific habits along with testing for mycotoxins and heavy metals, etc could provide some marginal benefits. Aside from maintaining your spare tire and fatigue from not getting enough sleep and exercise, there’s not much reason to ignore the main advice.

Anyway, here’s a Rhonda Patrick interview with Bredeson for the curious. So few people will actually do the protocol, time will tell if there’s anything to it.

https://www.foundmyfitness.com/episodes/dale-bredesen

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#72

Post by ALittleLight »

artfulhippo wrote: post #64
ALittleLight wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is pretty easy to deny. The CDC breaks out obesity by demographics[1]. White adults have an obesity rate of ~29%. This is the same as other predominantly white/Anglo countries like Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom[2]. Maybe 29% is staggeringly unhealthy, but it isn't American culture to be that overweight. Being overweight is fairly widespread and not unique to America. Probably it has more to do…

You may want to edit this comment. It reads as though you don't think Hispanics or Blacks count as American. I don't think you intend to express this racist sentiment, but it's easily inferred from the text as written.

I don't see how that sentiment can be read into what I wrote. I looked at three racial groups in America and observed they had different obesity rates. In abstract terms - "You think this quality is specific to the whole. If you divide the whole into three parts you can see the quality differs between the parts. This implies the quality is not specific to the whole."

To take that claim and infer that I mean to suggest the parts are not part of the whole is clearly nonsense.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#73

Post by sohdas »

ALittleLight wrote: post #49
nostrebored wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American culture is staggeringly unhealthy. Denying this is impossible.

I think it is pretty easy to deny. The CDC breaks out obesity by demographics[1]. White adults have an obesity rate of ~29%. This is the same as other predominantly white/Anglo countries like Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom[2]. Maybe 29% is staggeringly unhealthy, but it isn't American culture to be that overweight. Being overweight is fairly widespread and not unique to America. Probably it has more to do…

> America having more hispanics and blacks than places like the UK, the US seems like it is more obese.

Whether or not you actually meant it, this very clearly comes off as you saying that they aren't American.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#74

Post by ALittleLight »

sohdas wrote: post #73
ALittleLight wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is pretty easy to deny. The CDC breaks out obesity by demographics[1]. White adults have an obesity rate of ~29%. This is the same as other predominantly white/Anglo countries like Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom[2]. Maybe 29% is staggeringly unhealthy, but it isn't American culture to be that overweight. Being overweight is fairly widespread and not unique to America. Probably it has more to do…

> America having more hispanics and blacks than places like the UK, the US seems like it is more obese. Whether or not you actually meant it, this very clearly comes off as you saying that they aren't American.

How? The UK has more anglo people than the US. Am I implying that Anglos aren't United Kingdomers or Americans? The US has more white people than Sudan. Does that imply white people aren't American?

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#75

Post by crdrost »

krrrh wrote: post #71

Lots of comments dismissing this out of hand because of lack of evidence, but there aren’t any conventional treatments that are very helpful for Alzheimer’s. The lifestyle adjustments suggested in the protocol are largely healthy, not that hard to do, and offer other health benefits. They are also relatively uncommon so it’s not impossible that a broad based adoption of specific habits along with testing for mycotoxi…

Similar claims were also made by Dr. Lustig’s book Metabolical earlier this year, which of course is more concerned with the diabetic aspects but indeed considers Alzheimer's etc. metabolic disorders.

Not seeing Bredesen on the bibliography so I think the research is independent, some related citations from that bibliography:

G.J. Biessels and F. Despa. “Cognitive Decline and Dementia in Diabetes Mellitus: Mechanisms and Clinical Implications,” Nat. Rev. Endocrinol. 14 (10) (2018): 591. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41574-018-0048-7

B.J. Neth and S. Craft. “Insulin Resistance and Alzheimer’s Disease: Bioenergetic Linkages,” Front. Aging Neurosci. 9 (2017): 345. https://doi.org/10.3389/fnagi.2017.00345

S.S. Dominy et al. “Porphyromonas gingivalis in Alzheimer’s Disease Brains: Evidence for Disease Causation and Treatment with Small-Molecule Inhibitors,” Sci. Adv. 5 (1) (2019): eaau3333. https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.aau3333

M.P. Pase et al. “Sugary Beverage Intake and Preclinical Alzheimer’s Disease in the Community,” Alzheimers Dement. 13 (9) (2017): 955. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.jalz.2017.01.024

V. Berti et al. “Nutrient Patterns and Brain Biomarkers of Alzheimer’s Disease in Cognitively Normal Individuals,” J. Nutr. Health Aging 19 (4) (2015): 413. https://doi.org/10.1007/s12603-014-0534-0

S.M. Raefsky and M.P. Mattson. “Adaptive Responses of Neuronal Mitochondria to Bioenergetic Challenges: Roles in Neuroplasticity and Disease Resistance,” Free Radic. Biol. Med. 102 (2017): 203. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S08915...

So the claim is that ultraprocessed food is essentially making your mitochondria sick, and the recommended diet adjustment is not very different from Bredesen’s approach.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#76

Post by be_nice »

ALittleLight wrote: post #74
sohdas wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> America having more hispanics and blacks than places like the UK, the US seems like it is more obese. Whether or not you actually meant it, this very clearly comes off as you saying that they aren't American.

How? The UK has more anglo people than the US. Am I implying that Anglos aren't United Kingdomers or Americans? The US has more white people than Sudan. Does that imply white people aren't American?

It's logically implied by your words, "the US _seems_ like it is more obese." (Emphasis added.)

"Seems", as in "appears to be, but is not actually." The only way the US is not actually more obese is if Hispanics and Blacks do not count as "the US".

The only other way to read "seems" here is in the "I'm not totally sure, but this is what it looks like" sense. But this doesn't seem to be the way you're using this word, especially given that your entire comment is denying that the US is more obese purely in virtue of white obesity statistics.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#77

Post by curation »

nostrebored wrote: post #66
ALittleLight wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is pretty easy to deny. The CDC breaks out obesity by demographics[1]. White adults have an obesity rate of ~29%. This is the same as other predominantly white/Anglo countries like Canada, Australia, and the United Kingdom[2]. Maybe 29% is staggeringly unhealthy, but it isn't American culture to be that overweight. Being overweight is fairly widespread and not unique to America. Probably it has more to do…

You've linked me a list that shows the US nearly in the top 5% of the world for obesity and claimed that we're not unhealthy. Also the implication that white people are somehow genetically predisposed to obesity is strange, with plenty of countries existing as counterexamples. You've listed the obesity rate, not the rate of people who are overweight. Beyond that, you haven't limited to adults. According to the CDC [1…

I am studying in Russia and one of my teachers told me that it must be so that North Americans have some disease that has made them all so large. It was after I told him two of my neighbours had tummy tucks in the same month... he did not know what that was.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#78

Post by curation »

varelse wrote: post #10
wawayanda wrote: post #6

Maybe I'm a cynic but it strains credulity that the miracle cure is also a laundry list of fad health trends from the the last decade. Gluten free, intermittent fasting, yoga, melatonin, probiotics, etc etc

If what you're telling me is that eating healthy, getting enough sleep and exercising can halt or reverse Alzheimer's it's not going to exactly shock me. The real fad is how amazingly stupid Americans are about their own health.

Yes. I don't take all those supplements but I have performed most of the eating/sleeping/exercise rituals because it's normal to do that and not normal to not sleep 8 hours, overeat and not exercise. There are endless new markets to be created from telling people how to be healthy that is not: every day do the same healthy things forever. I think it is sad that this implies that we should wait until we have cognitive decline before we do anything.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#79

Post by adrianN »

krrrh wrote: post #68
pmoriarty wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They did a trial, https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.05.10.21256982v ..., and it worked very well." Only 25 patients, not double-blind, no controls.

The protocol is mostly lifestyle changes, there’s no meaningful way it could be double-blind. It has to be compared to standard of care outcomes.

The control group could use a different set of lifestyle changes. Changing something always has an effect. You need to somehow figure out whether the changes you propose are better than just doing anything.

Re: Reversal of cognitive decline: A novel therapeutic program

#80

Post by ALittleLight »

be_nice wrote: post #76
ALittleLight wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How? The UK has more anglo people than the US. Am I implying that Anglos aren't United Kingdomers or Americans? The US has more white people than Sudan. Does that imply white people aren't American?

It's logically implied by your words, "the US _seems_ like it is more obese." (Emphasis added.) "Seems", as in "appears to be, but is not actually." The only way the US is not actually more obese is if Hispanics and Blacks do not count as "the US". The only other way to read "seems" here is in the "I'm not totally sure, but this is what it looks like" sense. But this doesn't seem to be the way you're using this word,…

If you are intent on finding offensive meanings you will be able to regardless of if they are there or not.

It's pretty clear that "seems" means that obesity seems to be a US problem unless you start looking at demographics, where similar demographics in different countries have the same rate of obesity (e.g. white people in the US, Australia, and Canada) and demographics in the same country have different rates of obesity (e.g. in the US blacks, whites, and Hispanics all have different rates of obesity).

I was not denying that the US is obese, to the extent that it is. I was explaining that it is not "American culture" that is the issue. Multiple groups that share "American culture" have different rates of obesity and groups that don't share American culture do share obesity rates.

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