Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Is going to the office a broken way of working?

newyorker.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

391–400 of 468 posts

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#391

Post by Draiken »

distrill wrote: post #279
zmmmmm wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get a lot of what you say but this one drives me bonkers: > able to tap people on the shoulder for quick questions rather than having to ping them over chat My work requires so much focus, having people randomly tap me on the shoulder to ask a question they could just drop in chat is debilitating. I'm curious you phrase "having to ping them over chat" negatively? I would say the same sentence almost totally in reve…

Even for something quick, I will type up a question and then go over it a few times, make some edits, probably provide some links for context. It just feels like a bigger deal than just asking someone next to you. In person they can cut me off when they start to get it, or I can tell from their face that I need to keep going with more context, it's just more more collaborative. In chat I'll either end up having to an…

But the act of tapping someone in the shoulder and break their concentration already does all the harm IMO.

Once you've done that, headphones on or off is redundant.

In my experience, 99% of these disturbances could be avoided with a bit more effort on the side of the person interrupting. So what generally happens is that the person concentrating loses his focus - very likely getting out of the zone - and helps them with something that they could've done themselves.

For me it really seems selfish the majority of the time. Urgent matters, things that really block you and you absolutely can't figure out, sure. Almost anything else can wait a bit for a response.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#392

Post by mikro2nd »

ketzo wrote: post #160
dboreham wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't think of a single job I've had where the lighting, desk and chair were remotely as good as I have at home.

That’s fair, but I think you have to acknowledge that the total opposite will be true for many, probably most, people. There’s a reason that “stop working at the kitchen counter” is, like, its own cottage industry of online writing. People mostly have really bad wfh setups, even people in tech.

Not sure... It seems likely to me that people who've been forced to work from home during the Covid pandemic tend to have crap office-space because it's only temporary. In contrast, people who have made a conscious decision/choice to work from home (as I've done for over 25 years, now) proceed by setting up a proper work space. (Along with developing good work-hygiene like keeping office hours sharply separate from personal time, keeping work in the office and not letting it spill over into the lounge, kitchen, etc.)

Main point: there's a marked (mental, emotional) difference between "this is a temporary emergency" and "this is the way I work (forever)".

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#393

Post by dogman144 »

whywhywhywhy wrote: post #387
dogman144 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely makes sense. A response I can offer you is this, And it’s loaded with empathy because I def get that people derived real fun from it. A lot of people attended those after-hour drinks as the semi-mandatory things they are, either for career survival or career acceleration reasons. This was always a large background narrative, and the death of it as of now is a nice thing. I’d take quarterly team dinners and…

You might be surprised to realize in a few years that they haven't died, you're just excluded from them. You might not like it, but after work drinking is one of the areas where a lot of the meat of innovation and progression in the company happens. I think a lot of people who double down on full remote are going to be surprised when they wake up in 5 years and realize they're pretty stagnant and have just become cog…

Lol, you'd be surprised to learn I'm not surprised in my expectation that these things will come back.

Referring to their death literally because the bars are closed for the last year and a half, despite the hit to innovation and progression that causes.

And I'll go to them once they're back, see "career progression reasons." The light ire my last comment contains is directed at the people that view these as lightweight friend happy hours, which these events have never been.

Golden rule - if my boss is remote, I'm still ok with remote. That said, your theory takes a hit with a full remote company at the eng and exec level, which many Series B/C/D startups are turning into.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#394

Post by disgruntledphd2 »

jrockway wrote: post #118
jedberg wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did too. But I always felt bad when we made a work decision at the bar and then the folks who didn't come out with us didn't get a say and had an uphill battle if they didn't agree.

Yup. I think that it probably falls on the side of "not good for the company", so it's not necessarily a bad thing that we can't do it anymore. Honestly, I think we mostly spent our time shit-talking people that weren't there, which isn't super healthy.

> Honestly, I think we mostly spent our time shit-talking people that weren't there, which isn't super healthy.

Honestly, I often feel like that shit-talking helps to keep people bonded over what can be pretty awful situations. I know that in my current job (to which I've given notice), I'd have loved to have a bunch of people from the office to talk to about it, and it might have lead to me staying longer.

Hard to know for sure though.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#395

Post by dogman144 »

jrockway wrote: post #283
dogman144 wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely makes sense. A response I can offer you is this, And it’s loaded with empathy because I def get that people derived real fun from it. A lot of people attended those after-hour drinks as the semi-mandatory things they are, either for career survival or career acceleration reasons. This was always a large background narrative, and the death of it as of now is a nice thing. I’d take quarterly team dinners and…

I totally understand that. I think we've made the world a little bit more fair for everyone by forcing people to schedule a 30 minute meeting during work hours to just chat or play games or whatever. No screwing up the commute, no forcing people to drink intoxicating substances, etc. Definitely net better. But, I personally enjoyed people being forced to socialize with me ;)

Respect the candor!

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#396

Post by 4ggr0 »

cgrealy wrote: post #230
willismichael wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My son, nine years old at the time, said "If you think the whole world is messed up, then you are messed up."

Nothing against your son, but at 9, you don't know much about the world. If you're an adult and you don't think the world is messed up, you need to learn more about the world.

To add to this to give a perspective from a young person - Approximately when I was 16 I started watching documentaries about the world, reading news, watching essays on YouTube etc.

I think the first eye-opener was when I was 18 and started working on my first job while starting to realize how corporations work and what kind of bull* working at an office contains.

Now I'm 22 and my curiosity combined with the pandemic really broke me in a way. I had so much time to watch and inform myself about social injustice, climate change, world politics that I'm now kinda pessimistic about anything.

I would say about myself that I am very well informed about what happens around the world and what the big issues are, on the other hand it makes me kinda depressed and the last couple of years have been filled with Weltschmerz[0] for me.

Maybe that's a phase of becoming an adult and becoming aware of what's going on. I certainly have no idea on how to handle it other than just feeling powerless and kinda sad.

Sorry for the rant.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weltschmerz

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#397

Post by joncrane »

emaginniss wrote: post #77
arrosenberg wrote: post #39

Co-locating with your coworkers isn't a broken way of working, per se, but the majority of our cities are not designed for work/life balance. If the office is a 5 minute walk, I have absolutely no problem going in and staying until the usefulness of being together is exhausted for the day. When the commute is an hour plus in traffic, that's gonna be a no from me dawg. Add on to that the fact that some regions have be…

When I had a mostly-remote job, I solved the traffic issue by coming in at 10am and leaving at 3pm on the days I'd visit the office. 2 days of that a week was enough to maintain contact, go to lunch with folks and handle any obligate in-person meetings.

...until some folks start scheduling meetings at 9:30 am or 4pm.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#398

Post by krageon »

Ancalagon wrote: post #59
taurath wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're correct, but one thing that is really missing nowadays, especially with phones and the internet, is active communities that exist in real life outside of work. Stuff like the elks lodge, rotary, bowling leagues, etc are just not as common anymore as I believe they used to be. Certainly there are many things that exist, but in a way societally it seems like they don't have very much cache, even as far a…

This is the other point I wanted to make (but frankly I was too scared that maybe it’s just because I suck at meeting people now that I haven’t socialized like a normal person in a year). It just seems harder to meet people _in general_ than it did even two years ago. Like where is everybody? Does everyone stay home literally all the time now?

I find the trick was (and is, really) to meet people online and to make appointments to meet them IRL.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#399

Post by krageon »

baud147258 wrote: post #371
atoav wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If everybody got the damn vaccine the thing would be over much faster. Not getting vaccinated or wearing a mask is an active effort to prolong the existence of a virus that doesn't give a damn about how people rationalize their bad decisions. And I stopped giving a damn about people who defend the metaphorical licking of rats during a plague. I have yet to hear a good rational reason for not getting a vaccine, that i…

well, considering how the pandemic went, a fire in a village is way more likely to directly impact you, compared to the covid directly impacting you. And it's not as if getting vaccinated prevented you from catching and transmitting the virus

At the height of it I could not kick a rock without hitting someone that had a family member die of COVID. I live in a country with reasonably good healthcare and I would say perfectly acceptable capacity (and I don't interact with a lot of pray-the-sick-away types), so I'm quite curious where you are located that you make such claims.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#400

Post by krageon »

kQq9oHeAz6wLLS wrote: post #347
felipellrocha wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> France, Germany and Italy have really disappointed with their heavyhanded approach against those that are not vaccinated. Disappointed who? The anti-vaxxer community? Good.

Point of clarification, because you're spreading misinformation: being opposed to one specific vaccine type is NOT the same as being an "anti-vaxxer." It will behoove you to be clear on that point.

> misinformation

The overlap between the two groups is so large and the justifications so similar that they may as well be the same. It is not useful for clarity, brevity or comprehension to distinguish the two.

Post reply on HN