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Open Source Tractor

opensourceecology.dozuki.com

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Re: Open Source Tractor

#131

Post by jaggederest »

namdnay wrote: post #110
ajuc wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do. Or, to be precise - they are daughter companies of global corporations that keep their marketshare thanks to IP.

And that’s why there are no cheap Chinese cars or trucks or tractors or guns or engines or any of that stuff ..

Many times you'll see a "knockoff" or semi-clone before the original product comes out, even. Which is amazing and awesome.

If our systems weren't built around intellectual property it would enable some pretty remarkable things.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#132

Post by robbedpeter »

brezelgoring wrote: post #123
5faulker wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the holistic level, their impact on the ecology is still to be known though.

Living in South America all my life, and I know this is anecdotal, ecology is always second to economic progress. You can't go to a [settlement] ( https://sfo2.digitaloceanspaces.com/elpaiscr/2019/09/Asentam... ) and tell them not to use certain tools because they might not be ecological. I'm not discarding your concern though, I understand its impact is not known, I just wanted to say it likely won't be a factor in…

There's a well known correlation between economic progress and ecological protection. The wealthier a community, the better it can make good long term decisions about maintaining the ecosystems around it.

When people are struggling, they use whatever they can to survive. They'll burn wood indoors, and strip the wooded areas of all trees, use up as much groundwater through wells as possible, and so on...

Get rid of the do-or-die hard scrabble for survival and people can start being better stewards. It's the largely invisible, widespread, and long term effects, like leaded gas and co2 impacts on climate that require nation state intervention through science based policy.

For highly empowering things like this, the upshot is likely that even though the tech is not likely to be as clean and efficient as we'd want, it will enable individuals and communities to thrive and better their lives to the point that they can start affording long term ecological preservation.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#133

Post by gnramires »

beckman466 wrote: post #81
rmason wrote: post #51

This project is terrific. People are critical of what it doesn't do, I'm in awe of what it does do. You're going to have little two man shops in Africa and Asia cranking these out and changing agriculture in their part of the world. This demonstrates the power of open source. These engineers are to be commended.

> This demonstrates the power of open source. These engineers are to be commended. if you haven't seen the famous Open Source Ecology pitch by Marcin Jakubowski, you're in for a treat! Open-sourced blueprints for civilization | Marcin Jakubowski , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GEMkvT0DEk

I need to watch that! I'm developing an algorithmically-driven civilization architecture concept.

(in the sense of, how to organize society from a blank slate point of view, while maximizing the wealth of experience for all individuals? I think we've gotten a little caught up in ideology and culture wars and stopped looking for ideas to move society forward with more efficient, humane, robust, collaborative (or adversarially cooperative) societal organization systems)

If you thought society as consisting of a large number of agents (with varying degrees of self-interest and diverse motivations), how would you design a system that enables maximum productivity, and maximum well-being? (in the sense of conscious experience: a rich and wealthy life; not necessarily tied to having particular stuff)

Seriously, in all our 100,000 years more or less of modern human existence we've seriously toyed with about 2 large scale architectures of society. Why can't we try better in a non-destructive way?

Re: Open Source Tractor

#134

Post by ethbr0 »

thechao wrote: post #121
WhisperingShiba wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a controversial opinion, but I agree. The global west is realizing it done goofed up; because China does not give a shit about IP and now has the intellectual capability to successfully produce new products which compete with US product. The good news is that China's economy is actually a bigger mess than ours somehow, despite our limited means of production. Everyone is too scared of nuclear war, but the act…

Isn't this the same situation that the USA eventually found itself in with respect to the USSR? I think the whole cold war can be re-envisioned as a socioeconomic conflict.

Re-envisioned?! The Cold War was explicitly a socioeconomic conflict.

What do you think the communist nations' ideological goal was?

Re: Open Source Tractor

#135

Post by AngryData »

hinkley wrote: post #129
AngryData wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They should definitely look into welding, they will need it at some point anyways for repairs. And a stick welder is both cheap and perfect use case for welding heavy metal frames. It could even be powered off the engine to be used in the tractor.

Refresh my memory. A stick welder is an electric arc welder that uses a thin rod of metal as the contact point and the rod gets consumed to make the bead, right? That sounds pretty reasonable.

Yes, it is very easy to use and you don't need bottled gas, just the welding sticks. The only real downside to it is it doesn't work as well with thin metal, but for an equipment frame that isn't a problem.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#136

Post by rcgorton »

throwaway894345 wrote: post #42
nimbius wrote: post #7

i work on heavy equipment such as tractors, diesel trucks and excavators in the USA. this is an excellent start, but its a long way from a tractor. some of the pitfalls that need to be addressed: "Modular Power Unit" is undefined. can i run it on white gas? diesel? kerosene? what is the engine displacement? air cooled or liquid? If we mean to say this tractor is all-electric, keep in mind most small farms arent equip…

> Cab frame has no safety glass or panels, so the operator enjoys every rock and every tree branch :(. a shade canopy is a nice add as well. These were luxuries only our nicest tractors had growing up ~20 years ago. I imagine the market for an Open Source Tractor can similarly make do without.

No. Professional farmers had enclosed cabs even around 1975.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#137

Post by i_am_proteus »

namdnay wrote: post #79
rmason wrote: post #51

This project is terrific. People are critical of what it doesn't do, I'm in awe of what it does do. You're going to have little two man shops in Africa and Asia cranking these out and changing agriculture in their part of the world. This demonstrates the power of open source. These engineers are to be commended.

I doubt that IP of tractor designs is a major factor in third world poverty. I’m sure there are factories in Asia pumping out cheap tractors already

Not just Asia. Mahindra, an Indian concern (with PRC operating units), builds some tractors and trucks in Africa (I know of plants in at least Mali and South Africa) for various African markets.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#138

Post by ncmncm »

It is great that they can make this thing work.

It is, at the same time, a serious indictment of modern industrial society that they want to. Industrial manufacturing economics ought to be supplying tractors cheaply enough that there is no temptation to this.

Re: Open Source Tractor

#140

Post by vasco »

gnramires wrote: post #133
beckman466 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This demonstrates the power of open source. These engineers are to be commended. if you haven't seen the famous Open Source Ecology pitch by Marcin Jakubowski, you're in for a treat! Open-sourced blueprints for civilization | Marcin Jakubowski , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6GEMkvT0DEk

I need to watch that! I'm developing an algorithmically-driven civilization architecture concept. (in the sense of, how to organize society from a blank slate point of view, while maximizing the wealth of experience for all individuals? I think we've gotten a little caught up in ideology and culture wars and stopped looking for ideas to move society forward with more efficient, humane, robust, collaborative (or adver…

What if we could throw what generations of people collectively built for a concoction some random dude came up with on their own? What about using the same time investment to contribute to improving our current systems?

Whatever you come up by yourself has zero chances of coming to fruition outside your apartment. Working on your local community to improve lives of real people or joining a political party and influencing the direction of debate is way more actionable.

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