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Is going to the office a broken way of working?

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Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#71

Post by mint2 »

Ancalagon wrote: post #8

I’m gonna go against the HN grain here and, despite having been fully for remote work for the first year or so of the pandemic, come out and say that life has really gotten a lot more repetitive and frankly disappointing since covid and the death of the office. I kind of miss meeting people in the office. I was in the unfortunate position of having moved to a new city for a new tech job where I knew nobody just seven…

Wfh really disrupted the days cues that indicate time and serve as reminders and habit triggers.

Wfh is great for some people, but I also find it monotonous and reduces daily variety amongst a number of other not great attributes more work related. My ideal is a 2-3 day in the office. Different options work better for different people.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#72

Post by IggleSniggle »

Ancalagon wrote: post #59
taurath wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're correct, but one thing that is really missing nowadays, especially with phones and the internet, is active communities that exist in real life outside of work. Stuff like the elks lodge, rotary, bowling leagues, etc are just not as common anymore as I believe they used to be. Certainly there are many things that exist, but in a way societally it seems like they don't have very much cache, even as far a…

This is the other point I wanted to make (but frankly I was too scared that maybe it’s just because I suck at meeting people now that I haven’t socialized like a normal person in a year). It just seems harder to meet people _in general_ than it did even two years ago. Like where is everybody? Does everyone stay home literally all the time now?

Well, yes. If not "everyone," certainly lots and lots of folks are just staying home whenever possible. Because we are in the middle of a global pandemic.

I think this has much more to do with "we are in a global pandemic" than "you can't meet people doing remote work." Certainly, there were a number of larger groups that I used to hang out with consistently pre-pandemic, but now have totally abandoned. I'm not interested in maintaining an online relationship with those groups; their value to me was in the face-to-face moments.

But that's just not a thing right now.

I'm certainly not going to go out of my way to expose my family to people who may or may not even believe in vaccinating themselves.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#73

Post by jdlyga »

My team pre-covid had half the team in New York and half the team in Warsaw. Post-covid, we have 1 person in New York, one in Philly, 2 in California, and 1 in Warsaw. We could've never set up a team like this if we were expected to be together in one office.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#74

Post by pineconebutt »

The worst part about the office in the United States is the car commute most people have. Besides that, it's not so bad. Socializing and feeling like a true part of a company is much easier when going to work. I like the office and the physical separation between more home and work life it provides. When I get home at the end of the day, I don't want work to be interrupting me. My home life is the priority when I am home.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#75

Post by mrtranscendence »

fernandotakai wrote: post #61
mrtranscendence wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting idea. Every two months seems like it could be prohibitively expensive, though, depending on the org. My company has a yearly event that's mandatory for every employee throughout the country, and a common complaint is just how much it costs to put on. Granted, you could make it cheaper by getting rid of the c-list celebrity MC and free drinks, but renting a space for 1500 people, paying for travel, getting…

i worked at company that is remote first and they did a company retreat every year (as well as team-focused retreats, like engineering, support, C-level). it was a blast -- you got a week of "free" travel w/ your SO (because it was just once a year, they paid for your SO to come with you). i loved it, because it was a time to get together, have some drinks, chitchat and do some super productive work.

If it was a week long, in a desirable location, and I could take my fiancee, I'd be all for it. But it's 1.5 days, no SOs, and held in a casino in the ass end of bumfuck Indiana. And forget about working -- it's centered around a team-building exercise with people from other parts of the company you probably don't know and will never talk to again.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#76

Post by true_religion »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #55
Ancalagon wrote: post #8

I’m gonna go against the HN grain here and, despite having been fully for remote work for the first year or so of the pandemic, come out and say that life has really gotten a lot more repetitive and frankly disappointing since covid and the death of the office. I kind of miss meeting people in the office. I was in the unfortunate position of having moved to a new city for a new tech job where I knew nobody just seven…

Your perspective is actually very common: Working from home isn't for everyone and we should stop pretending like it's the only way to work. A lot of people dislike remote work. Many people like remote work but can't handle it for various reasons. Internet forums like HN will always overrepresent preferences for remote work because they're biased toward people who enjoy socializing over the internet. Most people don'…

I don’t think there is any need to defend in person work. Until very recently it was the only socially accepted form of work.

As the default, we all have a little experience in it.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#77

Post by emaginniss »

arrosenberg wrote: post #39

Co-locating with your coworkers isn't a broken way of working, per se, but the majority of our cities are not designed for work/life balance. If the office is a 5 minute walk, I have absolutely no problem going in and staying until the usefulness of being together is exhausted for the day. When the commute is an hour plus in traffic, that's gonna be a no from me dawg. Add on to that the fact that some regions have be…

When I had a mostly-remote job, I solved the traffic issue by coming in at 10am and leaving at 3pm on the days I'd visit the office. 2 days of that a week was enough to maintain contact, go to lunch with folks and handle any obligate in-person meetings.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#78

Post by geofft »

IggleSniggle wrote: post #66
taurath wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're correct, but one thing that is really missing nowadays, especially with phones and the internet, is active communities that exist in real life outside of work. Stuff like the elks lodge, rotary, bowling leagues, etc are just not as common anymore as I believe they used to be. Certainly there are many things that exist, but in a way societally it seems like they don't have very much cache, even as far a…

Relatedly, I think this is part of what fuels more extreme social groups. If you don't have rotary/bowling/church/golf whatever group that you hang out with in real life, and you've got nothing else, then when you finally find a group they will be more likely to be a group that by its very nature has a stronger set of convictions; enough so that it overcomes the social norms and inertia and gathers in-person.

Aren't lodges, churches, and golf clubs kind of the stereotypical examples of race- and class-exclusionary groups?

I suppose it's not exactly a strong set of convictions if you're passively going along with broader social pressures to segregate on race and class, but if we're talking about the health of society (which I think we're implicitly doing), I think segregating on worldview is actually a whole lot healthier.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#79

Post by Ancalagon »

long_time_gone wrote: post #54
Ancalagon wrote: post #8

I’m gonna go against the HN grain here and, despite having been fully for remote work for the first year or so of the pandemic, come out and say that life has really gotten a lot more repetitive and frankly disappointing since covid and the death of the office. I kind of miss meeting people in the office. I was in the unfortunate position of having moved to a new city for a new tech job where I knew nobody just seven…

I fear it's another example of "optimizing" away something that made us more human (in this case, more in-person interaction).

Yeah this is another fear I have as well. Lots of the social interactions that made life better (albeit more difficult in some ways), were kind of automated away: dating, irl friends, etc.

Re: Is going to the office a broken way of working?

#80

Post by throwaway889900 »

mrtranscendence wrote: post #47
jedberg wrote: post #11

My friend runs a company that is remote first in the way described here. They have employees all over the world, but they all get together at some random place on the planet (pre-covid) about once every two months. The employees love it because of all the free trips around the world (and often tie their vacation to the beginning or end of a meeting so they can explore that place on their own) and it's great for the c…

Interesting idea. Every two months seems like it could be prohibitively expensive, though, depending on the org. My company has a yearly event that's mandatory for every employee throughout the country, and a common complaint is just how much it costs to put on. Granted, you could make it cheaper by getting rid of the c-list celebrity MC and free drinks, but renting a space for 1500 people, paying for travel, getting…

I imagine OP is talking about a significantly smaller company than 1500 people.
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