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Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

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Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#141

Post by Sabinus »

coryrc wrote: post #108
adgjlsfhk1 wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a short list of things tax money funds: Roads Schools Healthcare (in civilized countries) Making sure companies selling medicine aren't killing people Making sure companies don't dump toxic waste into rivers and lakes Note that comparing Walmart vs the government is especially funny since most of Warlmart's expansion comes from the fact that it under-pays it's workers so much that the federal government has to…

All that money we spent on roads has locked us into car-dependent infrastructure, killing 40k+/year directly and hundreds of thousands indirectly (air pollution, etc). Great job us.

I still don't see private corporations building better public infrastructure.

You get the quality of government you deserve. Remove corruption and regulate lobbying and donations and government money will be spent more effectively.

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#142

Post by pavlov »

rsj_hn wrote: post #134
weakwarm wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ARTICLE 1 1. The Czech Republic, the Republic of Estonia, the Republic of Cyprus, the Republic of Latvia, the Republic of Lithuania, the Republic of Hungary, the Republic of Malta, the Republic of Poland, the Republic of Slovenia and the Slovak Republic hereby become members of the European Union and Parties to the Treaties on which the Union is founded as amended or supplemented. 2. The conditions of admission and t…

None of that claims that EU laws override Polish laws or that EU judges can override Polish judges when interpreting Polish law. From the treaty: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL... "To the extent that a provision of the Charter refers to national laws and practices, it shall only apply to Poland or the United Kingdom to the extent that the rights or principles that it contains are recogni…

As others have said, you’re seemingly ignoring the existence of EU regulations which apply automatically without needing to be transposed into local law, and of the Court of Justice of the EU whose decisions are binding for local courts.

Both of these were established by the treaties that were in place when Poland joined, and further reaffirmed in the Treaty of Lisbon (which was supposed to be the clarified and rewritten European Constitution, but that was a bridge too far for some countries’ voters, so instead it became a web of amendments over the existing treaties).

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#143

Post by busymom0 »

mupuff1234 wrote: post #81
busymom0 wrote: post #16

I have never understood the whole "tax the rich" idea and I am not rich, don't own a house or car or stocks or anything expensive. When and how will the taxes help you and me? The money just ends up going to a black hole for the government to spent inefficiently. And if you are in the US, the money gets spent on funding the military industrial complex for bombing more countries, regime changes, intelligence agencies,…

Even if tax money would all go into a black hole - you would still get a slightly more equal society just by having smaller wealth gaps.

Multiple lifetime politician members of the US Congress and Senate are multi-millionaires and have stocks in the very companies they are supposed to regulate. Thinking these people somehow care about wealth inequality or the poor people or will allow anything to change their own wealth is asinine.

Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Congress:

https://unusualwhales.com/i_am_the_senate/congress

Unusual Stock Trading by Whales in US Senate:

https://unusualwhales.com/i_am_the_senate

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#145

Post by rsj_hn »

pessimizer wrote: post #138
rsj_hn wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of that claims that EU laws override Polish laws or that EU judges can override Polish judges when interpreting Polish law. From the treaty: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL... "To the extent that a provision of the Charter refers to national laws and practices, it shall only apply to Poland or the United Kingdom to the extent that the rights or principles that it contains are recogni…

"the Treaties and the law adopted by the Union on the basis of the Treaties have primacy over the law of Member States, under the conditions laid down by the said case law." This does not read ambiguously. You asked for a citation, it was given, and now you're ignoring it. Unless you specifically show why this doesn't say what we think it does, you've lost your audience.

Just some of the carve-outs for Poland

https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...

" 1. The Charter does not extend the ability of the Court of Justice of the European Union, or any court or tribunal of Poland or of the United Kingdom, to find that the laws, regulations or administrative provisions, practices or action of Poland or of the United Kingdom are inconsistent with the fundamental rights, freedoms and principles that it reaffirms.

2. In particular, and for the avoidance of doubt, nothing in Title IV of the Charter creates justiciable rights applicable to Poland or the United Kingdom except in so far as Poland or the United Kingdom has provided for such rights in its national law."

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#147

Post by alvah »

xyzzyz wrote: post #25
jgeada wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet they tax individuals on our revenues and not our profits …

That’s because there are no “low-margin” wage workers, who make large figures in gross salary, but also have extremely high “costs of earning wage”. I can’t think of any wage worker who would fit this bill. At best, this could apply to some self-employed people, but they can just incorporate. Maybe it would also apply to very low-wage workers, if you consider food and housing as cost of revenue, but then again low wa…

That's not really true. There are and have been many states, provinces and cities where my line of work is rewarded with high pre-tax pay, but the cost of living in those places (especially housing) makes it uneconomic.

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#148

Post by [deleted] »

zdragnar wrote: post #91
alex_young wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're describing is called a Progressive Tax system: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_tax

Most progressive tax systems only have you pay the higher rated on the amount in that bracket to avoid the disincentive. More accurately, this is a form of alternative minimum tax- a higher floor than the normal brackets specifically for those who cross a specific threshold. That does carry a hefty incentive to play games with your accounting, and is ultimately rather foolish since the people it was really aimed at w…

[deleted]

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#149

Post by dzink »

pmoleri wrote: post #82
dzink wrote: post #61

It matters who is not in. Cyprus doesn’t seem to be on the list, along with many others. All it takes is one country to make this irrelevant.

Only if the joined countries don't implement some kind of differentiated tax on products and services commiting from outside the list.

If the earnings are attributed to the country of evasion, and it is secretive as they all always are, how does the country of residence even know or prove how much they need to tax. The pandora papers would not be so revealing if it wasn’t for the secrecy part.

Re: Ireland joins OECD International Tax agreement

#150

Post by rsj_hn »

pavlov wrote: post #142
rsj_hn wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of that claims that EU laws override Polish laws or that EU judges can override Polish judges when interpreting Polish law. From the treaty: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL... "To the extent that a provision of the Charter refers to national laws and practices, it shall only apply to Poland or the United Kingdom to the extent that the rights or principles that it contains are recogni…

As others have said, you’re seemingly ignoring the existence of EU regulations which apply automatically without needing to be transposed into local law, and of the Court of Justice of the EU whose decisions are binding for local courts. Both of these were established by the treaties that were in place when Poland joined, and further reaffirmed in the Treaty of Lisbon (which was supposed to be the clarified and rewri…

Look at the promises made to Poland:

1. https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CEL...

"To the extent that a provision of the Charter refers to national laws and practices, it shall only apply to Poland or the United Kingdom to the extent that the rights or principles that it contains are recognised in the law or practices of Poland or of the United Kingdom."

" 1. The Charter does not extend the ability of the Court of Justice of the European Union, or any court or tribunal of Poland or of the United Kingdom, to find that the laws, regulations or administrative provisions, practices or action of Poland or of the United Kingdom are inconsistent with the fundamental rights, freedoms and principles that it reaffirms."

"In particular, and for the avoidance of doubt, nothing in Title IV of the Charter creates justiciable rights applicable to Poland or the United Kingdom except in so far as Poland or the United Kingdom has provided for such rights in its national law."

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