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Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

underdogdevs.org

21–30 of 115 posts

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#21

John Carmack has commented on this company before - does he have any affiliation? https://twitter.com/id_aa_carmack/status/1435307747470454787

I think he went to juvenile hall for breaking and entering, and so perhaps has some affinity for their cause through his experiences with that.

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#22
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

> Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

On the other hand, the USA opens around 500,000 coding jobs per year and graduates only 50,000 CS grads. Lots of room for inviting more people into the profession.

I had to research this recently for my greencard application. More context with sources: https://swizec.com/blog/software-engineering-best-job/

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#23
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

I don't think so, the only thing that separates lawyers/Dr's etc vs. developers is there is no requirement for a degree or certification for a developer. With the other professions there is.

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#24
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

what's wrong with blue-collar work? tech elitism never fails to amuse me.

anyway, there is a push to do the same for doctors [1] and lawyers [2], so your point is moot anyway. the problem is that with credentialed backgrounds it will never be as easy so it will always seem like tech is more accessible, which it is inherently.

finally, with respect to incarceration and being a part of a profession, unfortunately many hospitals and law firms will not hire felons, which is a problem in itself, but it's a fact. so this kind of website would be difficult for those fields. so even if med school and law school respectively weren't necessary, it would still be difficult. tech companies are very liberal in this aspect, actually.

[1] https://www.ama-assn.org/about/leadership/ama-s-strategic-pl...

[2] https://www.americanbar.org/groups/litigation/publications/l...

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#25
post #14
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

The short answer is yes, the bar for a developer is much, much lower than for a lawyer, a doctor, or an accountant, requiring much less training. Doesn't mean that there aren't some forms of development that require considerable skill and experience, but many positions just don't.

The bar is lower because we don’t have formal testing like they do, e.g. the bar exam or med school.

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People who think devs can become blue collar workers don't understand that you actually have to be smart to be a good developer regardless of credentials. The only difference between a programmer and a lawyer is a lawyer can't practice law on his own and get feedback without hurting anyone, and a programmer can get feedback from his laptop.

But you can get surprisingly far in the field without being a good programmer.

Incompetent people sliding by is hardly limited to programming

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#28
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

what's wrong with blue-collar work? tech elitism never fails to amuse me. anyway, there is a push to do the same for doctors [1] and lawyers [2], so your point is moot anyway. the problem is that with credentialed backgrounds it will never be as easy so it will always seem like tech is more accessible, which it is inherently. finally, with respect to incarceration and being a part of a profession, unfortunately many…

There is nothing wrong, except that, usually in a blue collar job, everyone is replaceable and the salaries are low to average.

Yes, all of this come from fear of not being able to make a living as a programmer in 10 years

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#29
post #11
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

Eager, but not "too." Reading this site I see very little interest from developers in professionalizing their industry. That would require standards bodies, licensing, and many other layers of management and cruft. Personally, I'd say good on developers for welcoming all comers. Hack the planet, you know?

<3

Re: Underdog Devs: supporting formerly incarcerated and disadvantaged aspiring devs

#30
post #8

Are developers the new blue-collar workers? I haven’t seen a similar program for aspiring lawyers, doctors or accountants. Aren’t we too eager to commoditize the profession?

what's wrong with blue-collar work? tech elitism never fails to amuse me. anyway, there is a push to do the same for doctors [1] and lawyers [2], so your point is moot anyway. the problem is that with credentialed backgrounds it will never be as easy so it will always seem like tech is more accessible, which it is inherently. finally, with respect to incarceration and being a part of a profession, unfortunately many…

You literally directly contradict yourself. You link to two pages that have absolutely nothing to do with getting formerly incarcerated people into law/medicine, then immediately concede that there isn’t an effort to do so because they’re not welcome in those fields.

Your failure to keep two paragraphs of texts consistent and coherent badly undermines your overall point. It’s pretty clear tech as a whole is a lot less elitist than law/medicine.

People are “elitist” because there is non stop pressure to drive down wages of engineers and it’s often disguised as progressivism. It can also undermine the professional and political power of engineers if the field is constantly portrayed as easy for anyone to enter. The AMA knows this better than anyone as they’ve tightly restricted the number of new doctors for decades, so it’s highly ironic you’d even link to them at all.

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