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Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

economist.com

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Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#71

Post by jszymborski »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #26

The biggest component missing from Silicon Valley's discussion of Facebook is its pathological lying. They lied to the FTC [1]. They lied to WhatsApp and the EU [2]. They created an Oversight Board and then lied to it [3]. (These just off the top of my head.) The culture is perceived to be dishonest from the top down. That is why they get bludgeoned more than Twitter, or even Tik Tok. That is what its surrogates miss…

I'm on the outside looking in, (and this might be an unpopular opinion in this crowd) but that's the reputation of tech in Silicon Valley, no?

The mentality is often "we'll be too small to prosecute until we're too big". That's how you end up with these seemingly superlegal entities like Uber, Google, hell even Crunchyroll.

Theranos was the peak example of how tech companies are encouraged to misrepresent fact to both users and investors to ensure engagement and investment.

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#72

Post by jwond »

whitepaint wrote: post #21

I don't really know much about US politics, but could this recent attack on Facebook be a political move and a power grab? Attack FB so they block certain groups / certain topics and promote what the regulators want? I listened to the whistle-blower's testimony and I didn't hear any reasonable solutions (in my opinion at least; I am a software developer myself). Also, it seems there might be some regulations imposed.…

Glenn Greenwald wrote an article arguing that yes, it is a power grab.

https://greenwald.substack.com/p/democrats-and-media-do-not-...

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#73

Post by jessaustin »

eunos wrote: post #20

Personally I dont see persistent public outrage that can effectively diminish Facebook. The "threat" at the moment is the congress passing bill to somewhat stymie Facebook.

Facebook has the money to hire lobbyists. Any bill passed through Congress with Facebook as its target will (amazingly, surprisingly) serve mostly to entrench and enrich it. Whatever limitations are included will be miraculously avoided by Facebook and will completely destroy any nascent competitors.

No I don't know how they'll do it. Lobbyists must be craftier than the average citizen, because although their actions have the same results every time it's always seen as a surprise when e.g. a new Federal Communications Act eventually transfers billions of dollars to Ma Bell's two daughters.

The only way such a bill could actually fulfill its stated aim would be if someone whose interests were diametrically opposed to Facebook's commercial success spent more money on lobbyists than Facebook could. That simply isn't going to happen.

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#74

Post by HappySweeney »

bhupy wrote: post #31
tenaciousDaniel wrote: post #22

I still have a FB account because my family is on there, and even then I check it maybe once a month, if that. It's just not in my life anymore. When I do go on there, I have a hard time imagining how anyone could get sucked into it. Sometimes I feel like FB is a kind of scapegoat for social critique. Maybe because it's the largest, but not sure. Personally, it seems like Twitter is a much more malevolent cultural fo…

> Personally, it seems like Twitter is a much more malevolent cultural force Completely agreed, it's quite impressive that they've managed to remain unscathed in all of this. Every single criticism that one can level against Facebook applies to Twitter ten times over. At least with Facebook's properties, the core use case is still keeping in touch with friends and family. Twitter's only real use-case is providing a s…

I think 10x is a touch hyperbolic, but I agree otherwise. Much like FB, you can avoid the outrage porn by mercilessly unfollowing political accounts. Unlike FB, Twitter has an option to order things chronologically instead of by how outrageous they are.

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#75

Post by eclipxe »

metalliqaz wrote: post #39
shoto_io wrote: post #3

No. That’s what people like us and all the main stream media hope for. But: most people I know don’t have the slightest clue that Insta and WhatsApp belong to the FB group. And even worse: most of them don’t give a shit about the reputation of FB. They just want to send messages and share pictures through those apps.

My question is... why do people like us continue to work there? They know what is going on there more than anyone.

Because HackerNews is not real life and FB isn’t nearly as evil as reading HN would imply.

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#76

Post by qwerpy »

dogman144 wrote: post #44
mchanson wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Article doesn't disagree with your take: "The firm risks joining the ranks of corporate untouchables like big tobacco. If that idea takes hold, Facebook risks losing its young, liberal staff. Even if its ageing customers stick with the social network, Facebook has bigger ambitions that could be foiled if public opinion continues to curdle."

> Facebook risks losing its young, liberal staff. Spot on, and not just young, liberal. Old-ish and privacy minded. Mid-aged and right. Two crowds are critical though: - this is the talent pool: college campuses. FB's changing tone (sponsoring scholarships, sponsoring scholarships for non tech -> tech transfers, etc) is evident. - this is the management pool: mid-30's to 40's, married, coastal EMs or PMs, that have t…

That management pool isn’t going anywhere. Have a bunch of friends who work at FB, mostly immigrants. They don’t care about the reputation, or don’t have the luxury to. No one confronts them about why they work there at dinner parties. It pays the bills very well and allows them to buy nice houses and send their kids to private school.

It’s the lack of work/life balance that gets to them, not the reputation of the employer.

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#77

Post by [deleted] »

Joker_vD wrote: post #30
Clubber wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"boomer media can't comprehend this" Believing news is on the side of the citizenry is like believing HR is on the side of the employee.

What, and the corporations don't exist first and foremost to benefit their customers? Have I been lied to my whole life?

[deleted]

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#78

Post by vmception »

donatj wrote: post #57
vmception wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can recreate your social graph at any time by telling it your phone number, or email, or friending the same people. Any app is doing that and will find other friends on that app with shared contacts. You can even do it in a future FB account. With that knowledge it is easy for me to delete FB account, even if there are active group chats there.

I mean there’s also 15 years of memories going back to me in college. There’s sentimental attachment there.

Then download your data

I always do download + delete

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#79

Post by jessaustin »

throwaway9191aa wrote: post #12

Is there a non-paywall link that everyone is looking at? Or maybe I'm the only one without a subscription to the Economist. Or is the headline the only reason this is upvoted to #1, and people are just assuming what the article says?

Just turn off javascript for https://www.economist.com

Re: Facebook is nearing a reputational point of no return

#80

Post by CursedUrn »

morpheuskafka wrote: post #66
shoto_io wrote: post #3

No. That’s what people like us and all the main stream media hope for. But: most people I know don’t have the slightest clue that Insta and WhatsApp belong to the FB group. And even worse: most of them don’t give a shit about the reputation of FB. They just want to send messages and share pictures through those apps.

I was really surprised when Facebook added their branding to the splash screen of those apps. I thought the whole point was that no one even knew about it. WhatsApp at least is a little different (no in app ads, no infinite scrolling, at least in theory encrypted messages). But Instagram is literally just another incarnation of the exact same business model as FB with slightly different features.

I presume they made a big push to integrate Whatsapp/IG and Facebook (on a technical and branding level) to make it harder for anti-trust to break them up later.
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