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Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

developer.apple.com

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Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#121

Post by wruza »

echelon wrote: post #83
jackdeansmith wrote: post #16

Feels to me like public pressure is on Apple to actually justify their argument that their App Store policies are for the benefit of their customers. If that results in more policies like this that really do improve customer experiences, that's not the worst outcome.

Feels like a celebration of "Apple sticks it to the stupid app developers, hooray!" Except app developers are mostly small shops and startups. One-person operations. How would we like it if the web were forced to behave according to some governing body? It feels like some North Korean 1984 dystopia and we've all got explosive collars around our necks. It's anti-freedom, anti-American, anti-ownership, anti-Stallman. A…

Why don’t you just use pro-everything devices. Even top quality ones exist now, which can be reprogrammed to function as you wish. Apple is not the only option anyone has.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#123

Post by datavirtue »

nightski wrote: post #96
jeroenhd wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why using the blockchain got user data is such a stupid idea. The immutability makes it impossible to redact or remove information, even if that information is encrypted. The same is true foor P2P services where there is no central accounting system. Deleting the account shouldn't be a problem if all the "account" info is stored on the device itself, so if your reviewers aren't completely incompetent I don't…

Hate to break it to you but banks are not deleting your account immediately when you close it. They legally can't.

It's simple. Don't offer account deletion. You comply with both in that case.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#124

Post by arecurrence »

madars wrote: post #4
gumby wrote: post #2

Wonder if this can be used to unsubscribe from The NY Times?

I heard you can change your address to California, which then gives the option to cancel online (due to state law). It is absolutely ridiculous that NYT will happily take your card info online, but require you to be on hold to speak with their "customer care" to cancel. Maybe it is time to use virtual CC's a la privacy.com.

The Globe and Mail operates similarly. I spent some time while cancelling a few years ago informing them that making me call them to cancel is a crime in California. The person on the line cancelling my account was genuinely surprised.

Canada was the first to require simple unsubscribe for email lists... I'm surprised it still does not have a law to require online unsubscribe for media subscriptions.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#125

Post by wil421 »

turbinerneiter wrote: post #15

I remember that roughly 5 or 6 years ago, when I wanted them to delete my apple id, I had to call them. On the phone. And the guy told me, "if we delete your apple id, you will not be able to sign up with this mail again". I only realized after hanging up how little sense this makes.

I’ve had people try do use credential stuffing on my accounts after major breaches. It happened on a deleted instagram account and I’m glad they blocked it.

I’d rather it work the way Apple does it than have someone try to recreate a deleted account.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#126

Post by detaro »

echelon wrote: post #109
CheezeIt wrote: post #47

Apple shouldn’t be interfering with other businesses and their users like this. It’s sad to see people here celebrating their inability to run unapproved software.

Call and email your representatives like I do. You're not going to find support in a forum with 60+% Apple users. A lot of these people work for or have stock in this company. They don't see how this is a roadblock to competition and that this device is now in the critical path of 50+% of commerce. (Maybe they'll care more when they have to compete.)

Meh. I don't own Apple devices, am always arguing they shouldn't force apps to go through the app store and at the same time find this a very reasonable restriction for the app store to have.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#127

Post by bshep »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #104
bshep wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SiriusXM is like this as well, you subscribe/upgrade online but you have to argue with a support person for 30-40mins to cancel, at least you can do it on a chat on their website. Honestly if you can subscribe with a button you should be able to unsubscribe with a button.

It's outrageous that you can't cancel online as easily as you signed up, and we do need legislation to correct that. But when you have to talk to them on the phone, just say, "I sold the car." End of conversation. What are you telling them that gives them the hook needed for a 30-40 minute conversation? If all else fails, "I was just diagnosed with a terminal illness" or "I am required to report to the state penitent…

They say “well we have the online streaming you can use” or “we can txfer it to your new car” they’re just stubborn and incitvized to try to keep you. Whats worked the best for me is “i haven’t used it in 6months and dont want it”. theres nothing they can say to that.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#128

Post by zamadatix »

slownews45 wrote: post #77
jackdeansmith wrote: post #16

Feels to me like public pressure is on Apple to actually justify their argument that their App Store policies are for the benefit of their customers. If that results in more policies like this that really do improve customer experiences, that's not the worst outcome.

Most of their policies are ones CONSUMERS have liked but BUSINESSES have hated. The litigation / cases / govt intervention has been on behalf of businesses not consumers. A lot of folks in the "alliance for app fairness" have just horrible billing practices. Understandably, if they can get out of the app store, they can stop you from being able to do things like delete your account or unsubscribe with a few clicks. A…

> Most of their policies are ones CONSUMERS have liked but BUSINESSES have hated.

I'd agree here, the majority of the policies are likable by consumers.

> The litigation / cases / govt intervention has been on behalf of businesses not consumers.

Consumers don't have millions to throw around on litigation against Apple so it's no surprise the litigation is focused around business cases. On the government intervention side I disagree though, of the very little intervention there has been it has been consumer focused IMO.

In either case there is also some overlap of "business interest" and "consumer interest" even if the vast majority of the time there isn't so blanketing that all litigation has been on behalf of businesses does not imply all litigation is about policies not in consumer interest. And I think the courts have been very conservative on which points are actually acted upon even if there is a bit of a "throw it at the wall and see what sticks" approach to many of the cases.

> A lot of the newspapers make it easy to sign up, but then you have to call to cancel, the same papers that go on and on about how terrible the app store is. There is a REASON people spend fortunes, particularly in the apple app store - it's damn safe to do so in most cases.

If people are truly buying Apple devices because they only want to purchase things from the controlled app store then the availability of alternative app stores wouldn't be a concern, they would simply go unused. The truth is most people don't actually buy the devices for this reason which is why Apple is so afraid to give that singular point of control up.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#129

Post by ribosometronome »

madars wrote: post #4
gumby wrote: post #2

Wonder if this can be used to unsubscribe from The NY Times?

I heard you can change your address to California, which then gives the option to cancel online (due to state law). It is absolutely ridiculous that NYT will happily take your card info online, but require you to be on hold to speak with their "customer care" to cancel. Maybe it is time to use virtual CC's a la privacy.com.

Do any banks do a good job offering this feature for debit?

Back in one of the days, the PayPal TOOLBAR used to offer this feature, it was really convenient since you were essentially direct drawing from your bank account with it.

Re: Apple requires account deletion within apps in AppStore starting January 31

#130

Post by Arcsech »

not2b wrote: post #85
jb1991 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This raises one notable benefit of going through Apple for all payments -- as a customer, it buffers me from dark billing patterns of any random company. Companies like 37signals don't like it and claim it hampered their relationship with customers, and that might be true in some cases, but overall it seems like a benefit for customers to have a consistency process of buying, refunding, cancelling everything they use…

But if the price of that benefit is 30% off the top for Apple for all payments, it's a high price to pay. Perhaps better consumer protection laws would be a better way to fight the dark patterns.

As a consumer, I have effectively no control over laws. I do have control over which payment system I use. So if you as an app developer don't want to give a 30% cut to Apple, maybe push for better consumer protection laws so IAP doesn't have that incredible benefit for me.
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