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Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

forwardparty.com

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Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#431

Post by realce »

netcan wrote: post #418
realce wrote: post #353

I raised over 400k for Andrew's POTUS run and devoted a year of my life to running his official Reddit (104k subs at peak), then joined a SuperPAC to further his positions after the run. The campaign team was full of fools who squandered almost every good turn received, most campaign workers were paid less than minimum wage, and Andrew eventually stole the pac's name and branding - Humanity Forward - put everyone out…

IMO, this is an indictment of the structure, more so than the individual. First, a campaign is a makeshift setup, staffed just in time and fired shortly after. Second a campaign is a campaign. It's about media attention, hammering messages and getting elected. Anything but a messy collapse, post election, is unlikely. I'll suggest that what you wanted to be involved in isn't an individual campaign, it's a party or so…

1000% agree.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#432

Post by realce »

hwers wrote: post #420
realce wrote: post #410

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have dm'd you proof, please edit your comment upon examining it and enjoy your day :) oh you can't do that here - my mistake -- this is where proof went, but I'd like to keep my reddit username kinda separate from here, hope yall understand.

I don't understand how that is proof of anything? Am I missing something. I'm just seeing an image of a subreddit.

The 2 green icons next to the title indicate that it's a mod post and that it's stickied to the top of the reddit, and the title of the post is that dude's username.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#433

Post by NineStarPoint »

Pelic4n wrote: post #391
realce wrote: post #353

I raised over 400k for Andrew's POTUS run and devoted a year of my life to running his official Reddit (104k subs at peak), then joined a SuperPAC to further his positions after the run. The campaign team was full of fools who squandered almost every good turn received, most campaign workers were paid less than minimum wage, and Andrew eventually stole the pac's name and branding - Humanity Forward - put everyone out…

>He's not trustworthy, he's a horrible manager of people, and he never pays off on what he promises. The man was running for POTUS. Do you expect the men who lead the world to uphold your own moral standard? From Machiavelli's The Prince: >Every one admits how praiseworthy it is in a prince to keep faith, and to live with integrity and not with craft . Nevertheless our experience has been that those princes who have…

Out of the three things listed, being a horrible manager of people is definitely disqualifying for a presidential candidate (the primary job of the POTS is managing people.)

That said, while Machiavelli has a point, the opposite is also true: that many leaders have fallen due to losing the trust of their key supporters. No king rules alone, knowing how to keep your supporters happy while still being flexible is a vital talent for a democratic leader. Even more so, many states have fallen due to their allies deciding they can no longer be trusted in negotiations, and the president is the face of the US. You can see the consequences untrustworthy presidents have had in our weakening bargaining power with many of our allies, such as the EU’s many talks of becoming more self reliant. Having a president that at least knows how to appear to be keeping their word to people that interact with them is incredibly important in our current geopolitical climate.

Basically, trust isn’t valueless. A good manipulator knows how to weigh the positives and negatives of breaching trust.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#434

Post by dragonwriter »

ryandrake wrote: post #429
ericmay wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely interesting but could you explain or expand upon what your point was here?

I guess I was just responding to: > It’s hard for us to imagine seeing it break up but there is nothing that prevents that except our general desire to live together. That thing that prevents it is evidently the [EDIT: Supreme Court's interpretation of the] Constitution, so it's not just a matter of losing that general desire to live together. We'd have to at the very least go through the difficult process of amendin…

> That thing that prevents it is evidently the Constitution

Laws don't prevent things.

Laws provide a justification for people who want to prevent things fo act to prevent them.

If there is no will, the law does nothing.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#435

Post by Pelic4n »

AniseAbyss wrote: post #378
realce wrote: post #353

I raised over 400k for Andrew's POTUS run and devoted a year of my life to running his official Reddit (104k subs at peak), then joined a SuperPAC to further his positions after the run. The campaign team was full of fools who squandered almost every good turn received, most campaign workers were paid less than minimum wage, and Andrew eventually stole the pac's name and branding - Humanity Forward - put everyone out…

Sounds like any other politician. I sometimes wonder: is idealism good knowing that you will be disappointed every single time or is aloof cynicism and sarcasm the way to enlightenment?

My own enlightenment was realizing that neither virtue nor the expectation of virtue was rooted in anything that I should concern myself with.

From Nietzsche's Thus Spake Zarathustra, The Virtuous: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1998/1998-h/1998-h.htm#link2...

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#436

Post by netcan »

realce wrote: post #431
netcan wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO, this is an indictment of the structure, more so than the individual. First, a campaign is a makeshift setup, staffed just in time and fired shortly after. Second a campaign is a campaign. It's about media attention, hammering messages and getting elected. Anything but a messy collapse, post election, is unlikely. I'll suggest that what you wanted to be involved in isn't an individual campaign, it's a party or so…

1000% agree.

Glad to hear it.

Yang Gang had/has the seeds of an interesting political paradigm, and a lot of that just emerged as people showed up on the sub. The paradigm was just not built to last, grow or evolve.

Do you see a path from A to B? It would be a shame to see a general dispersal, without any form of continuity.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#437

Post by ericmay »

ryandrake wrote: post #429
ericmay wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely interesting but could you explain or expand upon what your point was here?

I guess I was just responding to: > It’s hard for us to imagine seeing it break up but there is nothing that prevents that except our general desire to live together. That thing that prevents it is evidently the [EDIT: Supreme Court's interpretation of the] Constitution, so it's not just a matter of losing that general desire to live together. We'd have to at the very least go through the difficult process of amendin…

Ah I see. I don't see a legal dissolution occurring so that wasn't something I was really tracking (but hey maybe that's the black swan event?). Much more likely IMO is another civil war (unlikely though because we're fat, happy) or the system becomes so dysfunctional that people aren't willing to shed blood to get rid of it, but they largely ignore it.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#438

Post by slibhb »

kergonath wrote: post #252
dagw wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Economically middle in the road" is somewhat around classic Social Democrat politics Even more conservative parties in Europe are moving that way. Just look at the Tories in the UK for example, proposing massive government spending plans paid for by raising taxes.

That’s surprising only if you consider the Tories as being economically liberal. They are conservative in the sense that they look after the interests of the old aristocracy and a coalition of the rich. Their policies are intended to benefit a specific subset of the population. Their taxes (as well as things like the universal credit cuts) are perfectly aligned with that ideology. They don’t have a problem with the c…

No it's surprising because austerity was the Tory platform until Boris Johnson.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#439

Post by Loughla »

InitialLastName wrote: post #427
Loughla wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The green party has such an opportunity in rural areas. I've never understood why they refuse to see any amount of trade-off. Living in a rural area for a majority of my life, I can tell you that (not to make a no-true-Scotsman argument, but) most people are very concerned about the environment. When you are constantly surrounded by reminders that the world is changing, it is impossible to refute that fact. That many…

Doesn't denial of anthropogenic climate change, rather than simply being a semantic issue, undermine support for any attempt at mitigation?

I don't think so. Again, that's focused very much on semantics. If you dive in and really ask questions, outcomes are seen as the same, even if inputs are seen as different. Pollution is a problem, in their views, even if it isn't causing global warming.

The individuals (who I would note are actually very much in the minority) who steadfastly believe global warming isn't real, still identify that changes in species and/or weather patterns are happening.

It's not a stretch from there to mitigation. While they may not believe global warming exists, they do still understand that we need to make changes to our consumption, travel, and lifestyle patterns in order to ensure their children and grandchildren can have a planet worth living on.

I keep stressing global warming, because, in my experience, these individuals do not talk about climate change. They talk about global warming and how it's not a thing, even thought they identify that the weather is wetter and hotter sooner, then drier for longer periods of the year.

Re: Andrew Yang Founds the Forward Party

#440

Post by ineedasername »

netcan wrote: post #418
realce wrote: post #353

I raised over 400k for Andrew's POTUS run and devoted a year of my life to running his official Reddit (104k subs at peak), then joined a SuperPAC to further his positions after the run. The campaign team was full of fools who squandered almost every good turn received, most campaign workers were paid less than minimum wage, and Andrew eventually stole the pac's name and branding - Humanity Forward - put everyone out…

IMO, this is an indictment of the structure, more so than the individual. First, a campaign is a makeshift setup, staffed just in time and fired shortly after. Second a campaign is a campaign. It's about media attention, hammering messages and getting elected. Anything but a messy collapse, post election, is unlikely. I'll suggest that what you wanted to be involved in isn't an individual campaign, it's a party or so…

indictment of the structure, more so than the individual.

It seems to me that someone who wants to change the way the country works should at least be able to do a little better with how their campaign works and treats it's people. Yes, the work is short term and I think people know that going in. But mistreatment & broken promises? Not acceptable. Again, for someone trying to change the country, changing those aspects of their campaign, where they have much more control, had better be easy.

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