Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#51

Post by SavantIdiot » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:22 PM UTC

prvc wrote: post #29

What concrete information has been revealed that implicates Facebook in illegal behavior? How does the "whistleblower"'s stated desires wrt goverment-mandated moderation standards differ from those articulated by representatives of the company itself? Such a framework would shift liability away from the company, possibly reduce their moderation load, and create a significant barrier for entry for potential competitor…

If you can't moderate your platform, you shouldn't have a platform.

This "Boo hoo we can't moderate ... " wipes tears with billions of dollars... is deadly comedy, yet lots of people fall for it.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#52

Post by travoc » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

ausbah wrote: post #26

why would you reveal yourself if you don't have guanareteed protection?

Facebook likely knew the identity of the leaker right away. There was little advantage to maintaining the illusion of anonymity at this point.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#53

Post by runawaybottle » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:23 PM UTC

phantom_oracle wrote: post #13

Firstly, it is sad to say that HN is becoming more negative like the rest of the internet. On the front page there are more articles devoted to the ever-evolving shit-show of American-focused news issues. There are far less links to things that I THINK HN is more suited for: like BGP protocol or building your own ham radio. That aside, my theory about whistleblowing is that it is a counter-intuitive exercise that res…

It’s because that blockchain someone made is being used as national currency somewhere (and contributing needlessly to global energy consumption), and because that photo sharing site is causing body image issues, and that ad-tracker is building a digital trail of everything you do, and that ML algo is identifying protestors, and and and …

We are not discussing the shit show, we are the shit show.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#54

Post by jasondigitized » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:24 PM UTC

shmatt wrote: post #36

There is something that doesn't sit right with me about the whistleblower. Yes, she is a data scientist which gives her many many extra points. But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. Her actual scope of the what was going on in FB as a huge org, as she's trying to comment on (the "I want to fix FB" quotes from 60 minutes) Everyone I know who works in FAANG, FB specifically, and PMs even more specifically, really hav…

The importance here is she understands the B2C model for revenue which is to test and test some more and let the date optimize your funnel. That’s the story and that method has lots of unintended chickens coming home to roost

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#55

Post by xxs » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:24 PM UTC

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #45

Me1000 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really an "angle", she worked with a whistleblower protection organization and she specifically gave these documents to the SEC, filing 8 complaints with the regulatory organization. All of that communication is protected. I don't know what the legal implications for leaking to the press are, but that's where her exposure is.

Her bigger risk is probably the employment angle. Hard to picture hiring this person except if you're 100% certain your company's behavior aligns with her morals, and you can't find anyone else. Even for people who generally agree with her view on Facebook employing her presents a pretty serious known risk at this point.

She has politics written all over - not to worry.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#56

Post by nanidin » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:25 PM UTC

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #37

This story is on the current frontpage with 3 seperate threads, two even linking to the same outlet (NPR). When you go into the threads criticism of this call for greater government regulation of speech is met with personal attacks and other fallacious arguments. Might be just humans being overly excited humans, but this sure seems very organic.

My $0.02, but it seems like the moderation team (dang in particular) has been less active over the last 24 hours.

Usually there are reminders in large threads to click the "more" button to see all comments, but there was no such comment on the huge "Facebook-owned sites were down" post yesterday. They usually also merge duplicates and add top level comments with links to the other conversations taking place on the same topic.

The moderation team usually does a lot to reign in problem behavior, but there seems to have been a lot questionable comments making it through lately.

I have also noticed a lot of comments by users with "throwaway" in their usernames - seems like a shift in who is using HN and how they are using it.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#57

Post by asdfasgasdgasdg » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:25 PM UTC

xxs wrote: post #55

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Her bigger risk is probably the employment angle. Hard to picture hiring this person except if you're 100% certain your company's behavior aligns with her morals, and you can't find anyone else. Even for people who generally agree with her view on Facebook employing her presents a pretty serious known risk at this point.

She has politics written all over - not to worry.

That would be my assumption, or some kind of public policy position. Not to say that her concerns aren't genuine, but she has to be aware that for better or for worse she won't have an easy time finding further work in the industry.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#58

Post by q1w2 » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:25 PM UTC

jasondigitized wrote: post #38

Now do the same for CNN, Fox News and every other sophisticated media company who have all created Skinner boxes to get more eyeballs. The entire system needs a hard examination.

I suspect the reaction from a lot of companies is going to be to lock down internal documents under a need-to-know security model.

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#59

Post by warent » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:26 PM UTC

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #45

Me1000 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really an "angle", she worked with a whistleblower protection organization and she specifically gave these documents to the SEC, filing 8 complaints with the regulatory organization. All of that communication is protected. I don't know what the legal implications for leaking to the press are, but that's where her exposure is.

Her bigger risk is probably the employment angle. Hard to picture hiring this person except if you're 100% certain your company's behavior aligns with her morals, and you can't find anyone else. Even for people who generally agree with her view on Facebook employing her presents a pretty serious known risk at this point.

I'm having doubts, seems that most startups and small/medium businesses will not care at all. Have you seen the market? Engineers are ridiculously scarce. Most hiring managers and execs will just say something like "Great, we're too small and don't do anything like Facebook. Just keep her in the code and restrict access to Google Drive"

Re: Facebook Whistleblower Leaks Thousands of Pages of Incriminating Internal Docs

#60

Post by alfalfasprout » Tue, Oct 05, 2021, 5:26 PM UTC

shmatt wrote: post #36

There is something that doesn't sit right with me about the whistleblower. Yes, she is a data scientist which gives her many many extra points. But, she was a PM for 2 years in FAANG. Her actual scope of the what was going on in FB as a huge org, as she's trying to comment on (the "I want to fix FB" quotes from 60 minutes) Everyone I know who works in FAANG, FB specifically, and PMs even more specifically, really hav…

Well, yes and no.

While as a PM (or IC) she'd be primarily working on a scoped area of work, the reality is also that she likely didn't come to learn all this on her own. At nearly any large tech company it's pretty easy to get in touch with someone on another team and learn more about their work, etc.

The fact that she's been able to get all this context and significant supporting documentation points to her not having gone about this totally solo (despite her claims).

There's also something to note about things being intentionally ambiguous-- that's by design to prevent most ICs from putting together broader context. But it's not clear that it would prevent a highly motivated employee from amassing broader context. Like I said before, with even a bit more context other ICs can be looped in to fill in the gaps.

You're giving Facebook far too much credit here.