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Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

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Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#51

Post by hunterb123 »

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #32
hunterb123 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Should have heard the "whistleblower" on 60 minutes. Facebook is causing ethnic cleansing she said, lol. I didn't realize Facebook was so popular in China, that's the only place I know of ethnic cleansing being carried out. This is clearly orchestrated to get FB to censor more. Twitter has already fallen in line completely, that's why they are off the radar even though they are 1000% more toxic and teenagers are more…

So, you missed the news about Myanmar? Or the stories about the First Nation children being found in graves outside of schools (and this is recent, not something from 100 years ago)? Or children being taken from their parents at the US border and 'losing' the records in order to reunite them? I'm sure there are more, but these were the examples I could think of from the top of my head.

FB is not the cause of the issues though, and they could simply shut it down in that region but are other social media companies operating there? Do we have the same outrage with the Taliban and other terrorists using Twitter?

Yes, terrorists and failed states shouldn't be allowed to use these services, let's not muddy that with censorship issues though. Let's ban the terrorists, not content from Americans.

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#52

Post by dylan604 »

mc32 wrote: post #18
endisneigh wrote: post #7

What's the solution tho?

Turn off the algos and do chronology with proximity (geographic and social graph) instead of oh, we see you clicked on an article about Bernie Sanders, have a look at this article about taxing rich people 95%!! Or you read about hotdogs, here’s an article about additives in foods and their impact on mental health!!

Sometimes algo browsing can be interesting, so maybe a "I'm feeling lucky" type of option with a "Would you like to know more?" button

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#53

Post by epgui »

The comments section looks like a grade 11 class.

Not everything is about “controlling” you, not everything is a “fake narrative”, the world isn’t out to censor you, and no, not every form of censorship is bad. Yes censorship is a slippery slope, but so is intellectual laziness.

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#54

Post by jokowueu »

trutannus wrote: post #22
fighterpilot wrote: post #12

The two best ideas I've heard: - Require age verification by law and ban kids from using it. We ban kids from alcohol we should ban them from this. - Require ID verification by law but allow people to use a fake name. Fixes the bots issue and the kid depression issue. The market isn't going to get there by itself because of competition. If insta implements this then they lose market share to snap. So there's a strong…

> Require ID verification I'll pass on putting my personal ID in the hands of an organization that sells data as a business . No matter how many flimsy laws they put in place to ban selling my PII, you'd have to be born yesterday to think that won't just delay the sale this new treasure-trove of information.

HIPAA isn't a flimsy law and works quite well . Something similar can be used

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#55

Post by scop »

roody15 wrote: post #31

To me this is a fake story being promoted as a way to further a political narrative. Nothing the whistleblower has revealed is shocking or previously unknown. Yes facebook tweaks an algorithm on your news feed to drive engagement and make money. Yes facebook allows some content that some would consider not to align with mainstream US narratives. My two cents this is an attempt to force facebook to kowtow to the US an…

Let's also remember that Facebook has decimated traditional media. Traditional media seems awfully excited by this "whistleblower"!

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#56

Post by Factorium »

fighterpilot wrote: post #12

The two best ideas I've heard: - Require age verification by law and ban kids from using it. We ban kids from alcohol we should ban them from this. - Require ID verification by law but allow people to use a fake name. Fixes the bots issue and the kid depression issue. The market isn't going to get there by itself because of competition. If insta implements this then they lose market share to snap. So there's a strong…

There's an even simpler solution: ban free social media. Require each platform to charge a minimum of $x/user/year.

You remove kids by default (no credit card/bank card), and the focus of product managers is less on driving addictive browsing, and more on driving renewals (presumably through quality features, content, and fostering community).

The customer is no longer the advertisers (or shady Governmental data scrapers), but now the users.

Look at the generally higher quality of Netflix content compared to free-to-air TV.

You could apply the same regulation to other addictive products: p*rnography and games. These categories would also improve in quality, be less exploitative, and become less available to children, if a minimum payment was required for access.

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#57

Post by convexfunction »

mrfusion wrote: post #26
fighterpilot wrote: post #12

The two best ideas I've heard: - Require age verification by law and ban kids from using it. We ban kids from alcohol we should ban them from this. - Require ID verification by law but allow people to use a fake name. Fixes the bots issue and the kid depression issue. The market isn't going to get there by itself because of competition. If insta implements this then they lose market share to snap. So there's a strong…

Those sound too chilling. I’d propose banning algorithms for services with over one million users. Users must have complete control over what their feed shows. (And ability to filter)

I'd just love to see how the law operationalizes and the courts interpret something like "banning algorithms".

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#58

Post by shadowgovt »

dylan604 wrote: post #35
fighterpilot wrote: post #12

The two best ideas I've heard: - Require age verification by law and ban kids from using it. We ban kids from alcohol we should ban them from this. - Require ID verification by law but allow people to use a fake name. Fixes the bots issue and the kid depression issue. The market isn't going to get there by itself because of competition. If insta implements this then they lose market share to snap. So there's a strong…

Kids are still able to buy alcohol by having other people do it for them. They also steal it. During a house break in, the police will often ask if any alcohol is missing which is a tell tale that teenagers were involved. Kids are not simple, and will often out wit the adults in order to do things they want to do. It amazes me how adults seem to forget the things they did as teenagers, and maybe if they were actually…

"Kids will break the law" isn't a compelling argument to not have the law in the first place. Is it unenforceable? Probably not; it leaves a hell of a digital trail to make a fake account if someone cares enough to tie it together. And even rarely-enforced laws declare that something is unacceptable in society and set a guard rail that most people follow.

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#59

Post by buitreVirtual »

btmiller wrote: post #33
convexfunction wrote: post #21

The clearest take I've seen on this: https://www.piratewires.com/p/bombshell The money quote, in my opinion: > The thing is, we’re not really asking for Facebook to control itself, we’re asking Facebook to control other people.

But they are the ones that have enabled the mass accessibility of many-to-many communication. That should come with great responsibility.

And the ones who profit by exacerbating toxicity.

Re: Whistleblower to Congress: Facebook products harm kids and democracy

#60

Post by AndrewBissell »

Mizza wrote: post #45

I find it weird for a whistleblower to be so "lib", as the kids say. She said she 'loves' Facebook, and wants to fix it, not harm it. I don't want Facebook fixed and I do want Facebook harmed. I don't want the government to meddle with what types of things people can say online, I want them to ban the business model of stalking people online and selling intimate details of their lives. If the problem is Facebook choo…

Comparing the fate and level of media attention paid to this whistleblower versus e.g. the Vault 7 leaker is a good little hint about just how bothered the powers she's supposedly speaking truth to really are.
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