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Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

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Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#91

Post by ramraj07 »

cinntaile wrote: post #87
ramraj07 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can write lists like that for pretty much half the genes in the genome. If you ask a pharma company to rank order genes they would like to get exclusively as targets these would be ranked in 4 digits if not 3. There’s a reason no lab bothered to discover it for so long. Sydney Brenner said in the 60s that they already discovered all there is to molecular biology and leave the details to the “Americans” (1). These…

I guess Sydney suffered from scientific hubris, it happens to the best of us ;) What can I say. Next year there'll be a new price, maybe you'll be more impressed with next year's choice.

Sydney might be proud and vain but his statement of relevance here was not due to that. Scientists are supposed to constantly try and indemnify what’s hard and important and pursue those fields. He said that statement because back then he believed the important fields to explore were developmental biology and neuroscience. More recently he wrote an editorial suggesting how a field like connectomics would be the equivalent new, exciting, important field would be.

The celebration of mediocrity with Nobels for no real reason except probably politics (I sat near to the Nobel cabals in lectures these candidate prize winners will come give talks at) isn’t in the interest of science or progress is all.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#92

Post by ramraj07 »

baktubi wrote: post #82
ramraj07 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard disagree. These are for lack of better word standard discoveries that the high intensity labs discover with pretty much standard methodologies and no Innovations worthy of a Nobel. Of course we have receptors for heat and touch, and of course someone eventually found them. What’s original in that process? This is not RNAi, or CRISPR, or GFP. One of the more underwhelming Nobels in recent times. Somehow worse tha…

Hard disagree your hard disagree. If you throw a vase in the air it will fall down and shatter: like, duh it’s gravity. But how many years to figure the equations? To tie the how/why to the obvious? Don’t trivialize their work because your work didn’t receive a Nobel. K thanks. These discoveries could be game changers for prosthetics, brain computer interfaces, augmented reality, etc.

I’m trivializing their research based on their inherent triviality. Any new gene could be game changers for a plethora of ailments. The correct gravity comparison would be trying to celebrate someone finding the value of g in Oxford when the original measurement was in London.

I didn’t say I am sour I didn’t get one. When did a film critic need an Oscar before he could criticize moviemakers?

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#93

Post by Arete314159 »

ChemSpider wrote: post #36
icegreentea2 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Nobel Prize typically rewards basic research, not applied - look up who got the prize with respect polio vaccines if you're curious.

Good point. In this case Katalin Karikó and Weismann are the frontrunners.

I've really been holding out hope for K. Karikó. She put up with such monumental struggles. Obviously the MRNA Covid vaccine is a huge "prize" and vindication for her, but I'd love to see even more. She deserves it.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#94

Post by ramraj07 »

suchow wrote: post #84
ramraj07 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hard disagree. These are for lack of better word standard discoveries that the high intensity labs discover with pretty much standard methodologies and no Innovations worthy of a Nobel. Of course we have receptors for heat and touch, and of course someone eventually found them. What’s original in that process? This is not RNAi, or CRISPR, or GFP. One of the more underwhelming Nobels in recent times. Somehow worse tha…

The criteria for winning the prize depend more on the outcome of the research (importance) than its process (originality): "The said interest shall be divided into five equal parts, which shall be apportioned as follows: /- – -/ one part to the person who shall have made the most important discovery within the domain of physiology or medicine …” (Excerpt from the will of Alfred Nobel)".

Again, why are these genes more important than say, GM-CSF? That gene has 10 times more therapeutic importance than these genes. I can name 500 genes more important for any practical purpose than these genes. That’s the reason none of the early scientists were scrambling to discover them.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#95

Post by adolph »

chucky wrote: post #68
bumby wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does that go for the "Nobel" prize in economics as well?

I don't know and I don't care about that faux prize. The Peace prize is handled by a special Norwegian committee in accordance with Nobel's wishes, so it has its own everything (including its own ceremony), while the other prizes are all under the same umbrella in some form (although I believe the scientific subcommittees doing the acual awarding are independent).

They could probably expand brand awareness by creating a NobelX prize for locally popular Nobel-esque work.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#96

Post by snambi »

ramraj07 wrote: post #47
docdocgoose wrote: post #17

I appreciate that some Nobel selections, like this one, are for core biological discoveries rather than hot topics. How our bodies perceive / interface with the world is fundamental to our human experience: Pain, temperature, positioning. And that these perceptions can be significantly modulated by how our bodies process them (eg pain). Not only is their actual body of work impressive, as it cuts across so many metho…

Hard disagree. These are for lack of better word standard discoveries that the high intensity labs discover with pretty much standard methodologies and no Innovations worthy of a Nobel. Of course we have receptors for heat and touch, and of course someone eventually found them. What’s original in that process? This is not RNAi, or CRISPR, or GFP. One of the more underwhelming Nobels in recent times. Somehow worse tha…

Nobel prize seems like a marketing agency to me.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#97

Post by beerandt »

kibwen wrote: post #42
thecopy wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who are they and how did they censor?

The parent is sarcastically suggesting that there is a conspiracy to suppress ivermectin for use in treating covid. Ivermectin won the 2015 Nobel for its use in treating roundworm parasites. (Just to be maximally clear, covid is a virus, not a parasite.)

Plenty of medicines are used for multiple things. Just because something is labeled X, doesn't preclude it from also being effective at Y.

I'm not claiming that ivermectin is effective or not, but there is an incentive in preventing any FDA approved treatments from being used against COVID:

emergency authorizations (including the current "full", "non-emergency" authorization that is contengent on the completion of ~12 additional detailed studies over the next 3 years) are only allowed by law if no FDA approved medicine is available as an alternative treatment.

The fact that other, still experimental medications and vaccinations are allowed is proof that the FDA doesn't consider the current "non-emergency" vaccine authorization to be a "fully" authorized one.

The full authorization of any new or existing medication would preclude all other experimental treatments from being used under emergency authorization.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#98

Post by GuB-42 »

bacro wrote: post #58
xattt wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may be conflating the mRNA vaccine with viral vector ones.

Not at all. Here is the news of a woman who died after getting the Pfizer's vaccine: (In Portuguese) https://politica.estadao.com.br/blogs/estadao-verifica/gover... The news say that it was unrelated to the vaccine and it was a heart attack. However, I do not believe in coincidences and am very skeptical that the vaccine has not had some effect on this. Note that she died 1 day after getting the vaccine.

6 billions vaccine doses have been injected, about 1% of the world population dies every year, doing simple math, it means about 160000 people should die less than one day after getting the vaccine from unrelated causes. Heart attacks are a common cause of death, if not the most common, at around 1/4. It means 40000 of these deaths should be heart attacks.

That's enough for me to believe in coincidences.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#99

Post by soheil »

ramraj07 wrote: post #94
suchow wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The criteria for winning the prize depend more on the outcome of the research (importance) than its process (originality): "The said interest shall be divided into five equal parts, which shall be apportioned as follows: /- – -/ one part to the person who shall have made the most important discovery within the domain of physiology or medicine …” (Excerpt from the will of Alfred Nobel)".

Again, why are these genes more important than say, GM-CSF? That gene has 10 times more therapeutic importance than these genes. I can name 500 genes more important for any practical purpose than these genes. That’s the reason none of the early scientists were scrambling to discover them.

Something as fundamental as heat and pressure are not important? I don't have a biology background, but learning that we just discovered these genes gave me the impression that we're still living in the stone age. Kudos to the award recipients for discovering the genes responsible.

It's probably that much harder to find these genes responsible for such basic sensory abilities that so much work must have gone into them if not for their lack therapeutic importance as you suggest, but also for the prestige scientists knew they would receive if they did discover them first.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine 2021

#100

Post by Zitrax »

sz4kerto wrote: post #10

I believe Nobels for mRNA vaccines will come next year or in the year after. There's no urgency when it comes to awarding Nobel Prizes.

Related: Here is an article investigating the delay between discovery and award: https://physicstoday.scitation.org/do/10.1063/PT.5.2012/full...

As can be seen there the delay is often measured in decades. For medicine many awards around 20 years or more after discovery.

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