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The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

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Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#61

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

k__ wrote: post #28
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

The problem is not, people making mistakes. The problem is, people making mistakes and saying they weren't mistakes. Or they give non-apologies.

I would prefer not to live in an apology economy, thanks though.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#63

Post by dkarp »

AutumnCurtain wrote: post #45
imgabe wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, and in that time people having the opinion that black people should be free would have been considered to have “wrong” and “dangerous” opinions that would cause great damage to society. Would we be better off today if those in power then had been able to silence unpopular opinions?

We are best off when we acknowledge that "opinions" can and do deal deadly harm every day, and not avoiding that point when it is explicitly made.

Today's valid opinion is tomorrow's invalid opinion and vice versa

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#64

Post by inglor_cz »

InitialLastName wrote: post #18
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

I think the extent matters as well.

I am not sure if humans can exist without blacklists. Some people definitely have the instinct to create them.

But nowadays it is fairly easy for every employer out there to check out whether there is a 'controversy' in your past or not, even if you are not a traditional celebrity.

Being less employable in Miami is one thing. Being less employable in the entire Anglosphere is another.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#65

Post by AlwaysRock »

I think pressure has always been high to conform. Maybe even more so in the past. But if you decided you didnt care you could relocate and your past wouldnt follow you around as much. Now the worst moment of your life could be the first thing anyone who googles you finds and it will never go away.

It's an incredible time we live it.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#66

Post by klyrs »

mc32 wrote: post #41
InitialLastName wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Publicly espousing an unpopular opinion now can be career suicide Let's not pretend this is new: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_blacklist The difference now is that visibility is more uniformly distributed across the population.

No normal person will deny this. But there is no comparison to a small population being affected (ironically in the USSR, lots of artists and authors got not only blacklisted but sent to the Gulags --gee, I wonder if they wrote to Stalin on behalf of their brethren) to potentially anyone and everyone being a potential subject at any moment for something otherwise innocuous. What’s more this is much worse. It’s not ab…

> But there is no comparison to a small population being affected to potentially anyone and everyone being a potential subject.

If I may paraphrase... there's no comparison between oppressing a minority I don't belong to, and the entire population being subjected to the same risk.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#67

Post by nicbou »

In my opinion, this social cooling is the strongest argument in favour of privacy.

Imagine there's a camera in your living room. You don't know if it's turned on, whether anyone is watching, or why they would be. However, I guarantee that air guitar solos will be fewer and further between. You won't walk around naked, pick your nose or watch questionable content anymore. You might even avoid certain conversations. Even without known consequences, you will police your own behaviour, just in case.

Digital surveillance is a lot like that, but you know that someone is watching. You just don't know whether they are paying attention, or what their motives are.

Even worse, if the people who watch get greedy, if the government forces their hand, or if their security is breached, there's no telling how your data will be used. This sword will always dangle over your head.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#68

Post by inglor_cz »

Goronmon wrote: post #24
wonderwonder wrote: post #14

Social media has massively amplified the penalty for making a mistake or offhand remark. People used to make tasteless jokes all the time and it was treated as it was, just a joke and life continued. Now anything out of the pale that catches the attention of some sort of influencer spells doom. Anyone caught at a bad moment on camera is pilloried, made out to be the anti christ and have people actively seeking out th…

Where do you draw the line though? Are we never allow to criticize someone for their opinions or "jokes", regardless of content or context? It's easy to just state "People should be able to make jokes or have a bad day." and while maybe that's true, I don't think we should be able to brush off all behavior by just labeling it a "bad day".

I would say that criticism of opinions or bad jokes is still OK, but given the dynamism of virtual mobs, one should be more careful how it is done. Triggering an avalanche is rarely a good thing, in mountains or on Twitter.

As far as I am concerned, a personal "between four eyes" criticism goes the longest way.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#69

Post by bingohbangoh »

Things like this is why its important that people can be anonymous on the internet. It gives you the way out to properly criticize people without fearing needless repercussions.

And yes, I'm aware of the risks of it being abused by trolls. It is a tradeoff we are better off making.

Re: The reputation economy is turning us into conformists (2017) [video]

#70

Post by gnicholas »

inglor_cz wrote: post #48
germinalphrase wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Making show dead the default would be a nice step.

After setting "show dead" to "on", I am rarely more enlightened than before. It seems that HN moderators are an order of magnitude better at their jobs than average and recognize value or its absence fairly well.

I believe comments die due to sufficient flagging/downvoting, and that moderator intervention is not required.
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