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New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

pcworld.com

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Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#21

Post by MBCook »

DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #15
mjevans wrote: post #4

Finally, a clear logo showing if a cable supports 240W. The USB 40Gbps logo is fine too. Now can we also get some logos for the other speeds: 20Gbps, 10Gbps, 5Gbps, 0.4Gbps (480Mbit). Also the other (PD 2.0+) power levels: 100W, 65W, 45W, 27W, 15W. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_hardware#USB_Power_Deliver...

> Finally, a clear logo showing if a cable supports 240W. Trademark law never stopped dodgy Amazon cable sellers before though.

And the other end of the spectrum you have companies that don’t bother to include it even if the cable/device would match the certification.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#22

Post by MBCook »

white-flame wrote: post #18
Daishiman wrote: post #3

It's a start, but my understanding is that not all data is created equal in USB3 land, correct?

Across USB-C land, there's the various USB3s as well as Thunderbolt, DisplayPort, PCIe, and probably others, too, all sharing the same connector with arbitrary overlaps or omissions of compatibilities across the N-dimensional matrix.

USB 4 is supposed to fix this by basically removing all the optionality.

Of course I don’t know how you tell if a device/cable is reliably USB 4 or not.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#23

Post by gumby »

In classic USB committee style, they try to do the right thing and still bungle the naming/marketing.

Just like the absurd “hi-speed/super speed” debacle, they fail to mention what people really want to know:

“Will this drive my monitor?” — bandwidth tells me most of what I need to know but to the average user it makes no sense.

“Is this a fast cable for my external drive”? “Is this really expensive cable overkill for my external drive?” Sorry, most people will have to guess, and will get the more expensive one “just in case”

“Will this work with my YYY” (i.e. “Does this have the alternative mode I need” — who knows?

“Will this charge my XXX?” - this is mostly right TBF: if device wants Y watts, choose a charger and cable with that number or larger. The knowledgeable user may be able to “trickle charge” their device in a pinch but not everyone needs to know this,

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#24

Post by dustintrex »

oddity wrote: post #17
Titan2189 wrote: post #7

Surely I wasn't the only one to immediately think of this? XKCD Standards: https://xkcd.com/927/

This isn't a case of a standard coming along to a crowded market. Rather, this is the opposite scenario. USB-C won and now they have to deal with the fallout of unifying all the things past, present, and future.

Previously we had tons of incompatible plugs, but if the physical plug fit, you were reasonably assured that it would actually work. In our shiny new future everything is shaped like USB-C, but you can't tell whether anything will work simply by eyeballing the plug. I'm not convinced this is progress.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#25

Post by kortex »

icelancer wrote: post #12
Forge36 wrote: post #2

I know at some point I'm sure I asked for fewer connector types. Seeing it now: I suspect unique connectors to a purpose is insanely useful usability. Immediate failure feedback has it's uses. See NEMA outlet variation [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NEMA_connector#/media/File:NEM...

The NEMA code is exactly what I think about when I think about USB-C's failures. Imagine if NEMA connectors were standardized and the voltage/amperage was disconnected from the shape of the connector? Ridiculous. While a standardized USB-C connector with non-standardized features isn't that dangerous, it's equally stupid, and was solved decades ago.

1) NEMA connectors cannot signal how much voltage/power they can handle though. If they could, there would be more pressure to use a single connector

2) You absolutely can plug the wrong IEC13/14 cable in to incompatible devices, or pass more capacity than it's rated for. For example, I've seen equipment with IEC14 sockets that only takes 120V (not SMPS), nothing stopping you from plugging in a UK240xIEC13 and letting some angry pixies loose.

Is that IEC compliant usage? Who knows, but it's convenient so manufacturers do it anyways.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#26

Post by white-flame »

MBCook wrote: post #22
white-flame wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Across USB-C land, there's the various USB3s as well as Thunderbolt, DisplayPort, PCIe, and probably others, too, all sharing the same connector with arbitrary overlaps or omissions of compatibilities across the N-dimensional matrix.

USB 4 is supposed to fix this by basically removing all the optionality. Of course I don’t know how you tell if a device/cable is reliably USB 4 or not.

I hope they do like USB 3.0B and add yet another independent set of connector pins for 4.0, making it twice as large. /s

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#27

Post by kortex »

dustintrex wrote: post #24
oddity wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't a case of a standard coming along to a crowded market. Rather, this is the opposite scenario. USB-C won and now they have to deal with the fallout of unifying all the things past, present, and future.

Previously we had tons of incompatible plugs, but if the physical plug fit, you were reasonably assured that it would actually work. In our shiny new future everything is shaped like USB-C, but you can't tell whether anything will work simply by eyeballing the plug. I'm not convinced this is progress.

Or, you just buy ones adequate to your needs. Buy one visual style for charging, another for data, or label them if you are really neurotic. You can definitely tell the better ones, they are thicker and stiffer.

I'm all too eager to deprecate my box o' rando mini/micro/meso USB A/B/hard drive cables.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#28

Post by MBCook »

white-flame wrote: post #26
MBCook wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

USB 4 is supposed to fix this by basically removing all the optionality. Of course I don’t know how you tell if a device/cable is reliably USB 4 or not.

I hope they do like USB 3.0B and add yet another independent set of connector pins for 4.0, making it twice as large. /s

I’ve only run into those once in real life but man what a mess of a committee’s design.

Actually let’s go back to DB-25. Each pin can be one “feature” so you can identify which features a device/cable support by looking for which pin(s) are missing.

Re: New USB-C logos make picking USB cables, chargers less confusing

#30

Post by CameronNemo »

gumby wrote: post #23

In classic USB committee style, they try to do the right thing and still bungle the naming/marketing. Just like the absurd “hi-speed/super speed” debacle, they fail to mention what people really want to know: “Will this drive my monitor?” — bandwidth tells me most of what I need to know but to the average user it makes no sense. “Is this a fast cable for my external drive”? “Is this really expensive cable overkill fo…

I don't know much about altmodes. What does the cable need to do to make displayport work right?
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