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Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

blog.prologe.press

71–80 of 114 posts

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a solution desperately in need of a problem. Or a pyramid scheme in need of an excuse / justification.

Please do define how Bitcoin or Ethereum (among others) are "pyramid schemes". Cryptocurrencies have indeed been used for pyramid schemes by specific actors, but then again so has normal money, and many other things. Numerous people on this site who presumably have the intellectual faculties to know better toss that little qualification out from their mouths almost reflexively out of emotional crypto-hate, but have a…

[deleted]

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#72
post #38

As usual, here on HN, any time something is posted that relates to cryptocurrencies the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the idea. Overall HN (in my opinion) has a very good quality of discussion and I often read the comments before opening a link or even just for the sake of it. Nevertheless when it comes to cryptocurrencies that assumption goes out the…

> the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the idea

"the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the IMPLEMENTATION" - here, I fixed it for you :)

If you will read any longer comments about crypto here, then most of them will approve THE IDEA of crypto, and half will admit that they were early supporters of it. But not now.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#73
post #38

As usual, here on HN, any time something is posted that relates to cryptocurrencies the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the idea. Overall HN (in my opinion) has a very good quality of discussion and I often read the comments before opening a link or even just for the sake of it. Nevertheless when it comes to cryptocurrencies that assumption goes out the…

So you generally find commenters here to be smart and knowledgeable about tech topics, but you feel that crypto is the exception...

Is it also possible that you're just wrong about crypto?

Most of the people I know who are very enthusiastic about it also deeply misunderstand the technology and also some basic economics (e.g. deflationary vs. inflationary assets).

I think HN users get angry because the crypto space is a neverending parade of people getting tricked by pump-and-dump, wealthy elites, etc.

Recently, a friend was gushing about Dfinity and telling me I'm basically stupid for not seeing the promise of it... and now we find out it was a scam and the technology is just tokenized, centralized AWS.

When this happens often enough, it can be upsetting. It feels like being a doctor having to talk to antivaxxers over and over again.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#74
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crypto is a solution to the "problem" of centrally controlled money. I'm just not 100% sure that it is a real problem, but those who buy it either believe it to be, or at least, want to hedge for it.

It (centrally controlled money) is a problem if you want to fleece people for their retirement money in tech support scams or ransomware and avoid having your bank account being seized when the authorities catch up with you.

Except there are tons of crypto scams and governments have used the blockchain to find criminals by tracking payment flow.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cryptocurrency space has been almost entirely overtaken by people whose sole interest is to get rich from coins increasing in value. These people don’t actually care about the technical aspects or real-world use outside of how it creates buzz that makes the price go up. The field is basically fuel for the worst elements of the wider financial world - pure speculation, hype, volatility and discourse appealing to g…

Ignore those people then. There are communities dedicated to their projects and care about the underlying tech and long-term vision. Every industry, especially those involving money, will have unsavory elements. It's human nature.

Can you suggest practical ways to actually ignore those people?

It seems every online community these days is full of people hyping up a crypto project for financial gain.

I tried to curate my sub Reddits and still can’t escape it in the comment threads.

Even Product Hunt is just a launching ground for NFT projects these days, crowding out interesting other product launches…

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#76
post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See Bitcoin’s BIP-39. With crypto, if I can remember 12 words I can freely transport my life savings anywhere in the world and no government can seize my wealth without torturing me into giving up my passphrase. Can you share a similar strategy for refugees using fiat, gold, real estate, stocks or bonds?

This is feasible if you have something for long-term savings. At the same time though, this doesn't solve the day-to-day problems though (like transactions), especially in context of Africa.

I feel like your response embodies crypto critics quite well. Someone asks a question, someone answers how crypto helps and then someone else moves the goalposts.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#77
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is what the author meant. I think the key here is that it's easier for people to obtain financial literacy because crypto is more accessible than the current financial system.

Which is a ridiculous claim, both because 1) crypto is not more accessible, and 2) being able to access more financial services doesn't make you less financially illiterate.

How is it not more accessible? To open a bank account in the United States, you have to provide an absurd amount of identification and contact information. This usually includes:

>Your name & date-of-birth

>Your social security number

>Your driver's license and/or passport

>A video selfie for some online banks

>Your street address

>Your email address

>Your phone number

Some of those items can be difficult acquire and maintain, especially if you're starting from nothing. Additionally, many banks require a deposit, and most if not all online banks won't accept it in cash. Most online banks now also require a closed-source app that will, on Android, most likely also require Google SafetyNet, excluding many custom rom users. The street address requirement is a burden on those who live nomadic lifestyles, as you cannot (legally, iirc) use a virtual mailbox, and you have to depend on friends or family to receive any mail they send you.

I attempted to open an account at Ally last month and they denied me because they couldn't verify my identity, even though I'd accurately provided everything they asked me for. I assume it's because I'm not in the ChexSystems database or have no credit history. On the other hand, I can get an open-source bitcoin wallet on my PinePhone and just use it.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#78
post #73
post #38

As usual, here on HN, any time something is posted that relates to cryptocurrencies the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the idea. Overall HN (in my opinion) has a very good quality of discussion and I often read the comments before opening a link or even just for the sake of it. Nevertheless when it comes to cryptocurrencies that assumption goes out the…

So you generally find commenters here to be smart and knowledgeable about tech topics, but you feel that crypto is the exception... Is it also possible that you're just wrong about crypto? Most of the people I know who are very enthusiastic about it also deeply misunderstand the technology and also some basic economics (e.g. deflationary vs. inflationary assets). I think HN users get angry because the crypto space is…

I usually discern rational approach by the merit of the argument not because "someone wrote it on HN". If there is no argument but instead just blanket statements and negative remarks then I can somewhat safely assume that some thought process must've failed that person at some point - or at least I can gain no direct insight from it. I'm not really a crypto evangelist nor anyone involved in it technically (at the moment) but I do know enough to at least somewhat understand the scope of the Idea - which is enough to never dismiss the whole thing based on some perceived flaw of some implementation. It's slightly possible though, that HN commenters aren't approaching the topic of crypto significantly differently than other ones - but instead I just notice irrational comments more in relation to this subject - perhaps even because I know enough to recognize them easily. But it's very unlikely, even if true, that this would explain the whole thing away.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#79
post #73
post #38

As usual, here on HN, any time something is posted that relates to cryptocurrencies the discussion gets filled with negativity and even, seemingly unprovoked, outright hostility toward the idea. Overall HN (in my opinion) has a very good quality of discussion and I often read the comments before opening a link or even just for the sake of it. Nevertheless when it comes to cryptocurrencies that assumption goes out the…

So you generally find commenters here to be smart and knowledgeable about tech topics, but you feel that crypto is the exception... Is it also possible that you're just wrong about crypto? Most of the people I know who are very enthusiastic about it also deeply misunderstand the technology and also some basic economics (e.g. deflationary vs. inflationary assets). I think HN users get angry because the crypto space is…

Just because your friend misunderstood and jumped on a bandwagon doesn't mean that they're wrong. They have the right idea. Even non-technical people understand that cryptocurrency can solve real problems. However, not all implementations will be executed properly. Any new technology will have more failures than successes, and nobody can say which ones will come out on top until after hindsight. It's risky, it's business.

Re: Cryptocurrency and the unbanked

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is what the author meant. I think the key here is that it's easier for people to obtain financial literacy because crypto is more accessible than the current financial system.

Can you explain how it is more accessible? Grandma isn't doing crypto.

How is email more accessible than Usenet? Grandma isn't doing SMTP
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