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Re: undefined

#131

Post by rejectfinite »

sbierwagen wrote: post #56
the_pwner224 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately this is a very common problem with basically all modern high-end laptops that have a macbook-like form factor (e.g. not bulky gaming laptops with lots of cooling & ventilation). It's just not physically possible to make a machine that combines high end power hungry hardware, adequate cooling for that hardware, and a compact form factor. It's very sad that this is such a widespread problem and that there…

Or you can stick it on a "laptop cooling pad", a plastic platform with fans in it that blow on the bottom of the laptop. Twenty bucks on amazon. https://www.amazon.com/ThreeLeaf-10-15-6-Office-Laptop-Cooli...

Imagine buying this to your 2000$ laptop because it cannot actually be used.

Re: undefined

#132

Post by h3mb3 »

stonecharioteer wrote: post #63

I cannot conceive how Mace became defacto development devices. They're always heating up, their implementation of POSIX is sketchy at best, their peripheral support is horrendous in the name of aesthetics, and the keyboard is atrocious. This is not to say that there are better alternatives. I have a Dell laptop running Manjaro, which is the second worst laptop experience I've had by far (the first was my 2019 Intel M…

> the keyboard is atrocious.

The keyboards they've been using since the flawed butterfly mechanism are imo quite good to type on (16" 2019 model here, the first one to reintroduce the scissor switches iirc). Sure, not as good as older MacBooks (or ThinkPads, etc), but totally acceptable among the modern laptops.

Re: undefined

#133

Post by rejectfinite »

stonecharioteer wrote: post #63

I cannot conceive how Mace became defacto development devices. They're always heating up, their implementation of POSIX is sketchy at best, their peripheral support is horrendous in the name of aesthetics, and the keyboard is atrocious. This is not to say that there are better alternatives. I have a Dell laptop running Manjaro, which is the second worst laptop experience I've had by far (the first was my 2019 Intel M…

>And recently I've discovered how horrible my network is at home and I doubt I can build a desktop unless I route ethernet wires through the walls. (Can't do that).

There are PCIe wifi cards or USB wifi adapters for desktops...

If you are building a new desktop there is even motherboards with wifi built in

Quick search on your fav search engine https://lifehacker.com/how-can-i-add-wi-fi-to-a-desktop-pc-1...

You dont have to use ethernet cables for a desktop! And where did you get this notion from???

Sounds like the best for you is to build a desktop or buy one as you are using laptops and desktop replacement anyway.

Thats said, ethernet is the best experience. With covid video calls it gets pretty obvious who has bad wifi and who has crystal clear ethernet wires (◕‿◕)

Re: undefined

#134

Post by rejectfinite »

j45 wrote: post #6

Also applicable to 2018 MacBooks. Apple laptops are not able to cool themselves if used to any medium or higher capacity. A laptop cooler or cabinet fans underneath to draw air away are a must if you want anywhere close to the cpu power you are purchasing. An external keyboard is also a must to own a MacBook 2015-201i+ if it’s from the special years of dust existing on Earth,

Imagine having to buy extra fans to use your device at full power.

Re: undefined

#135

Post by sandworm101 »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #111
sandworm101 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> a machine that combines high end power hungry hardware, adequate cooling for that hardware, and a compact form factor. There is. You don't need to keep that hardware running 24/7. That is a problem in the OS and associated software. Apple could disable all these monitoring daemons and accept the tiny delays in starting various things, accept some fan noise, accept a mic that isn't tuned to a room, accept that the…

What you say may be right, but it's not really related to the parent's complaint. If you run a stripped-down distro of Linux, running only the bare minimum, no service listening for anything, no service reporting on anything, etc, the issue still stands if the user needs the beefy hardware for beefy actual work. Say they're working on some big project in a compiled language from the middle of nowhere with unreliable…

>>the user needs the beefy hardware for beefy actual work.

Beefy hardware or not isn't the point. My hardware is rather beefy. The delays I speak of are not delays in accomplishing the actual commuting task. I'm talking about those tiny delays in spinning up a piece of hardware. I don't car is my threadripper's 49 extra cores take a few milliseconds to wake up from a deep sleep. I can live with a microphone that takes a second to turn on as I dial a voice call. Once the actual task is going, those little delays are in the past. But Apple doesn't tolerate little startup/wakeup delays. Apple would rather burn a little power keeping everything ready at a moment's notice.

Re: undefined

#136

Post by mabcat »

sbierwagen wrote: post #56
the_pwner224 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately this is a very common problem with basically all modern high-end laptops that have a macbook-like form factor (e.g. not bulky gaming laptops with lots of cooling & ventilation). It's just not physically possible to make a machine that combines high end power hungry hardware, adequate cooling for that hardware, and a compact form factor. It's very sad that this is such a widespread problem and that there…

Or you can stick it on a "laptop cooling pad", a plastic platform with fans in it that blow on the bottom of the laptop. Twenty bucks on amazon. https://www.amazon.com/ThreeLeaf-10-15-6-Office-Laptop-Cooli...

I tried one of those, it didn't make a shred of difference. MBP 16" still throttled so hard it was frequently unusable.

Re: undefined

#137

Post by keymone »

rdsubhas wrote: post #122
keymone wrote: post #120

I wonder how much of this and other thermal issues with MacBooks are just a marketing stunt to better sell m1 devices. Not that m1 needs that kind of marketing, Apple yet again set the standard for best laptop on the market, possibly for another decade, but I can totally see these anti-intel subversions being discussed somewhere deep in the catacombs of the mothership.

Are you implying that they built in artificial stunt thermal issues in those 4 year old laptops, so that they can use that as marketing to sell more m1 devices 4 years in the future?

Yes. It’s one of the main selling point of m1 - being faster than intel and colder than intel. M1 is just a continuation of their A line which exists for a decade, so it’s not like it was a stab in the dark.

Re: undefined

#138

Post by KarlKemp »

lelandfe wrote: post #108
WA wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My MBP 16" can‘t run my LG Ultrafine 5K (sold by Apple) without fan noise. Recently I also figured out that "automatic switching of graphic mode" (enabled by default) causes noticeable input lag. If I type text, the last typed character sometimes doesn’t show until another character is typed or I have to wait up to 5 seconds(!). Turning off "automatic graphic mode switching" stopped the input lag completely, but the…

Similar feeling when I learned that my M1 Macbook doesn't support two external displays...

I'm using it on one of the Pro XDR displays, and it's quite impressive for the cheapest notebook to drive this monster of a pixel-wielding behemoth with zero issues or complaints...

(2732*2048 + 2560*1600 + 6016*3384 = 30,000,000 pixels, although I'm not sure if the iPad receives a pixel signal, or renders its own content)

So it doesn't seem to be a lack of graphics power that causes this limitation.

(Incidentally, the XDR and current-gen iPad pro displays are the first where I get the illusion, when watching high-res video, that there's an actual window in the display and I am looking at a real scene behind it)

Re: undefined

#139

Post by nickjj »

watermelon0 wrote: post #92
stonecharioteer wrote: post #63

I cannot conceive how Mace became defacto development devices. They're always heating up, their implementation of POSIX is sketchy at best, their peripheral support is horrendous in the name of aesthetics, and the keyboard is atrocious. This is not to say that there are better alternatives. I have a Dell laptop running Manjaro, which is the second worst laptop experience I've had by far (the first was my 2019 Intel M…

MacBooks have a great form factor (that's just a personal preference, but I believe that most people like it), including keyboard (except a butterfly one), hardware actually works (bluetooth, wifi, sleep), and OS is more consistent and less buggy than Windows from XP/Vista days. POSIX is not properly implemented, but that doesn't matter to the majority of developers. macOS shell feels like using Linux, with some diff…

> POSIX is not properly implemented, but that doesn't matter to the majority of developers

The non-GNU versions of popular command line tools and running Bash 3.x ends up being a nuisance. Scripts that work fine on WSL 2, native Linux and CI (also Linux) end up not working on macOS. It usually comes down to some flag not existing or working the same on macOS' version of [INSERT_POPULAR_CLI_TOOL] or a Bash 4.x feature not existing so you need to do things a different way. As someone who often writes shell scripts getting macOS compatibility feels like having to support IE 6 back in the good old days of web development.

Re: undefined

#140

Post by southerntofu »

the_pwner224 wrote: post #18
colordrops wrote: post #7

I tried this and it doesn't work. Turns out my MacBook was throttling to 30% due to overheating. This happens more frequently if you drive the GPU with an external monitor. Unfortunately the OS does nothing to notify you of overheating and throttling, which is an insanely stupid oversight by apple. I only found out because I noticed that the computer ran fine while running the AC, so I installed an app through Brew c…

Unfortunately this is a very common problem with basically all modern high-end laptops that have a macbook-like form factor (e.g. not bulky gaming laptops with lots of cooling & ventilation). It's just not physically possible to make a machine that combines high end power hungry hardware, adequate cooling for that hardware, and a compact form factor. It's very sad that this is such a widespread problem and that there…

> It's just not physically possible to make a machine that combines high end power hungry hardware, adequate cooling for that hardware, and a compact form factor.

Yes, and that's why it should be illegal for firms to sell broken devices as we can read in this thread. Stop pretending everything can be smaller and prettier, just build stuff that works no matter what it looks like.

Apple is also guilty on the smartphone front. They have basically pioneered the "throwaway phone" paradigm we are deep into now. I remember when "dumb phones" lasted many years and held battery for at least a week... we have let their shiny advertising corrupt our minds and have lost features and created even more environmental disaster as a result.

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