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Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

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Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#41

Post by laumars »

rich_sasha wrote: post #22
krisoft wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your doctor wouldn’t say that. Your doctor would prescribe you polylepiscin or some other vaguelly medical and scientifical sounding name. You wouldn’t know that the compound originally was found in black mamba venom unless you like geeking out on medicine history. (And if you like geeking out on that you would already know that nearly all drugs comes from weird things.)

Yes exactly. Bacteria in probiotic yoghurt come in from the guts... no one says “fancy like eating your own shit”?

In fairness, the U.K. adverts for probiotic yoghurts have said it contains natural bacteria found in the gut.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#42

Post by yung_steezy »

goldenkey wrote: post #39
mrestko wrote: post #19

The title is not good--lots of meds are betting than morphine...that's why we have all the other opioids: hydromorphone, fentanyl, remifentinil, sufentinil, oxycododone, etc. If you look at the Nature abstract linked from the news article, all they claim there is that the analgesic effects can be, "as strong as morphine." This also a protein which is inherently more expensive and difficult to turn into a drug compare…

Those drugs aren't better, in my experience, as a chronic pain patient. Morphine is way less addictive, longer lasting, with fewer side effects. Not to mention, it's natural, one of the main alkaloids from poppy. Now, I'm not a dolt who thinks natural is better. However, most synthetics are strictly worse from a therapeutic standpoint. This view is based on my experience with them and from my discussions with other p…

I've read that that stuff is bad for your liver. Worth keeping an eye out for signs of jaundice.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitragyna_speciosa#Liver_toxic...

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#43

Post by gremloni »

goldenkey wrote: post #39
mrestko wrote: post #19

The title is not good--lots of meds are betting than morphine...that's why we have all the other opioids: hydromorphone, fentanyl, remifentinil, sufentinil, oxycododone, etc. If you look at the Nature abstract linked from the news article, all they claim there is that the analgesic effects can be, "as strong as morphine." This also a protein which is inherently more expensive and difficult to turn into a drug compare…

Those drugs aren't better, in my experience, as a chronic pain patient. Morphine is way less addictive, longer lasting, with fewer side effects. Not to mention, it's natural, one of the main alkaloids from poppy. Now, I'm not a dolt who thinks natural is better. However, most synthetics are strictly worse from a therapeutic standpoint. This view is based on my experience with them and from my discussions with other p…

Kratom is such a terrible overall experience. I did it recreationally a few times and it’s always headaches and nausea the next day in some kind of hangover that lasts multiple days.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#44

Post by elliekelly »

krisoft wrote: post #18
GravitasFailure wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On one side, this is an incredible medical advancement and opens the door to a lot of other developments, but on the other side if my doctor said I was getting injected with snake venom...

Your doctor wouldn’t say that. Your doctor would prescribe you polylepiscin or some other vaguelly medical and scientifical sounding name. You wouldn’t know that the compound originally was found in black mamba venom unless you like geeking out on medicine history. (And if you like geeking out on that you would already know that nearly all drugs comes from weird things.)

Like Botox. The doctor doesn’t mention they’re injecting you with botulism (or maybe the toxin that causes botulism?) but they are.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#45

Post by DamnYuppie »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #32
Someone wrote: post #10

FTA: They admit to being completely baffled about why the mamba would produce it. I would guess it keeps their target calm. A panicking prey is more likely to injure the snake than one that dies before it realizes it got seriously bitten.

> being completely baffled about why the mamba would produce it Is it delivered in a dose sufficient to cause unconsciousness, or even just euphoric lethargy in its prey? If so, that sounds both effective and weirdly sweet, given nature's usual barbarism.

I am continually frustrated by and fail to understand how people can actually believe nature is barbaric. Nature is nature, it is kill or be killed, that is actually the natural order of things.

Outside of that is an anomaly reserved for those at the absolute apex of power. This power was accumulated by being incredibly adaptable and observant. Both of these qualities made our ancestors very very good at killing things.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#46

Post by goldenkey »

yung_steezy wrote: post #42
goldenkey wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those drugs aren't better, in my experience, as a chronic pain patient. Morphine is way less addictive, longer lasting, with fewer side effects. Not to mention, it's natural, one of the main alkaloids from poppy. Now, I'm not a dolt who thinks natural is better. However, most synthetics are strictly worse from a therapeutic standpoint. This view is based on my experience with them and from my discussions with other p…

I've read that that stuff is bad for your liver. Worth keeping an eye out for signs of jaundice. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitragyna_speciosa#Liver_toxic...

Thank you. Most of that, like plant protein powders, is due to heavy metals in the soil the plant is grown in, or adulterants. I've been using Kratom for over 5 years with no elevated liver enzymes. It's actually made me healthier since it, like other dark green leafy vegetables, has many micronutrients and minerals.

NEVER buy kratom from a gas station or head-shop. That's likely where most of incidents stem from.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#47

Post by JumpCrisscross »

DamnYuppie wrote: post #45
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> being completely baffled about why the mamba would produce it Is it delivered in a dose sufficient to cause unconsciousness, or even just euphoric lethargy in its prey? If so, that sounds both effective and weirdly sweet, given nature's usual barbarism.

I am continually frustrated by and fail to understand how people can actually believe nature is barbaric. Nature is nature, it is kill or be killed, that is actually the natural order of things. Outside of that is an anomaly reserved for those at the absolute apex of power. This power was accumulated by being incredibly adaptable and observant. Both of these qualities made our ancestors very very good at killing thin…

> frustrated by and fail to understand how people can actually believe nature is barbaric. Nature is nature, it is kill or be killed, that is actually the natural order of things.

Barbaric literally means primitive and unsophisticated. (Sophistication referring to knowledge and culture.) When we say something is barbaric, we mean it is in its natural, unrefined, untouched-by-civilisation state.

That might make the statement "nature is barbaric" seem tautologic. But your reaction exposes its meaning. The natural state of things, the barbaric state, is on we strive to escape. It is painful and suffering. Sometimes cruel. Enough to have motivated our species to seek to not be subject to it. To be free of the "natural order of things" by developing our knowledge, culture and civilization.

As you mention, this often involved killing. But killing need not be painful and cruel.

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#48

Post by samhw »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #47
DamnYuppie wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am continually frustrated by and fail to understand how people can actually believe nature is barbaric. Nature is nature, it is kill or be killed, that is actually the natural order of things. Outside of that is an anomaly reserved for those at the absolute apex of power. This power was accumulated by being incredibly adaptable and observant. Both of these qualities made our ancestors very very good at killing thin…

> frustrated by and fail to understand how people can actually believe nature is barbaric. Nature is nature, it is kill or be killed, that is actually the natural order of things. Barbaric literally means primitive and unsophisticated. (Sophistication referring to knowledge and culture.) When we say something is barbaric, we mean it is in its natural, unrefined, untouched-by-civilisation state. That might make the st…

> Barbaric literally means primitive and unsophisticated

This makes for the foundation of a nice story, but no, that's not what 'barbaric' means. It's not what you'll find in any dictionary, and it's not what the root of the word is. Barbaros, in Greek, referred to non-Greeks, with an early connotation of foreignness. It picked up a connotation of cruelty and savageness as early as the Romans. Any dictionary since then will give a primary meaning of cruelty and savagery, not just 'primitive and unsophisticated'.

(Finally, my eight years of Ancient Greek at school comes in slightly handy!)

Re: Black mamba venom is 'better painkiller' than morphine (2012)

#50

Post by [deleted] »

nonameiguess wrote: post #34
eth0up wrote: post #8

I really hope this goes somewhere. I've been left on the curbside with a caduceus up my backside because of self-righteousness, paranoia and hysterics. If an analgesic can be created without committing the atrocity of inadvertently imparting a synthetic sense of wellbeing too, much suffering would end. Just don't poison it with acetaminophen! Maybe I'll abandon my unfruitful hunt for opium lettuce and raise snakes in…

I understand exactly what you're saying and it's a shame you're currently being downvoted. People up in arms against opioids and in favor of all the restrictions that keep people suffering have clearly never experienced chronic pain. I don't want to downplay addiction risk, but everyone I have ever seen get addicted had it happen with severe mitigating circumstances like job loss, general financial insecurity, family…

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