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Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

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Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#51

Post by SilverRed »

IshKebab wrote: post #20
curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

Give it another 20 years... https://www.google.com/intl/en/ipv6/statistics.html

looks like another 10 years at most going by the current rate. And I expect it will speed up at the end when we reach something like 90% and some sites go v6 only.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#52

Post by throw0101a »

cmroanirgo wrote: post #38
curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

For me it's a few things that keep me from fully embracing it, & largely the problem is perception, as others have noted. 1. I'm a small-time self hoster. I need/want to control access to geographic locations and using IPv4 makes that pretty easy. Last time I checked, IPv6 was just so wrong that it's no good to use at all, and most IPv6 addresses were "unknown" in origin. 2. I'm used to the pseudo security that a NAT…

> 2. I'm used to the pseudo security that a NAT gives.

If you wish to do this with IPv6 you can with ULA and NPTv6:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unique_local_address

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6-to-IPv6_Network_Prefix_Tr...

> 3. All those ICMPv6 messages sniffing (and snooping?) really don't fill me with joy joy happiness.

For those wondering: ping works by sending ICMP(v4) echo request packets. If you wish to block v4 ping you block echo requests (Type 8) and echo replies (Type 0):

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Control_Message_Proto...

ping6 works by sending ICMP(v6) echo request packets. In IPv6-land block Types 128 and 129:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_Control_Message_Proto...

To block traceroute block Types 11 (v4) and 3 (v6): TTL/hop exceeded notifications.

> IPv6 really does feel like a Godzillian monstrosity and a chore to type in: double colons between every number and it's in Hex? At least with IPv4 you can type the numbers in pretty rapidly on a numpad.

We've run out of IPv4 addresses. We need a larger address space with more bits. More bits mean more typing. Get over it? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#53

Post by yyyk »

curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

>What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

Partly some protocol choices which are quite different from IPv4, but much more importantly - existing users see relatively little benefit from conversion, so most new IPv6 installs are new installations.

Eventually the monetary pressure would be enough to get a critical mass to switch, but this hasn't happened yet.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#54

Post by throw0101a »

josephcsible wrote: post #16
nsoxo wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why change something that works?

Because we're running out of IPv4 addresses, and in a lot of cases, NAT doesn't work.

> Because we're running out of IPv4 addresses, and in a lot of cases, NAT doesn't work.

We have run out of IPv4 addresses. Past tense. Go to a RIR for some and you'll be put on a waiting list.

If you want a block of IPv4 space you'll be paying about US$ 30 per IP at the moment.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#55

Post by throw0101a »

nsoxo wrote: post #5
curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

Why change something that works?

> Why change something that works?

Because it does not work.

Want to run a public service with end-to-end connectivity? Go to your RIR to request an IPv4 block and be put on a waiting list.

Or break out your cheque book and be prepared to cough up $35+/IP for the privilege of global connectivity:

* https://auctions.ipv4.global

* https://ipv4marketgroup.com/ipv4-pricing/

* https://ipv4connect.com/marketplace

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#56

Post by throw0101a »

trevcanhuman wrote: post #6
an_d_rew wrote: post #2

Thank you! I know it’s all the rage to say “gee why no v6 yet?”, but that’s a LOT of infrastructure and testing to overhaul… The effort is much appreciated!

I don’t really understand the benefits, would you mind explaining them to me ?

> I don’t really understand the benefits, would you mind explaining them to me ?

Want to run a public service with end-to-end connectivity? Go to your RIR to request an IPv4 block and be put on a waiting list.

Or break out your cheque book and be prepared to cough up $35+/IP for the privilege:

* https://auctions.ipv4.global

* https://ipv4marketgroup.com/ipv4-pricing/

* https://ipv4connect.com/marketplace

Or get an IPv6 address block right away for $0.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#57

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

> What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

Any code storing an IPv4 address in a uint32_t can be hard to port to IPv6. Likewise, many codebases have their own ad hoc parsers for IPv4 dotted quads and would choke on anything else.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#58

Post by wmf »

throw0101a wrote: post #29
curiousmindz wrote: post #3

It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). I would have thought that all the major tech companies supported it years ago on all their infrastructures, websites and apps. But there are still a lot of hold outs. What about IPv6 makes it such a chore to become widespread?

> It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). IPv4 had just as slow a roll out in some ways. TCP/IP had its flag day in 1983: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_day_(computing) There was early commercialization of the Internet around ±1990, but it didn't really start taking off until around 1994: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercializatio…

So it took 15 years to build the entire Internet from scratch but it's taking over 20 years to upgrade to a new version.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#59

Post by lazide »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #50
mike_d wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A core or edge router in a terabit+ scale network is a far cry from getting someone in China to make you a bunch of Netgear clones. The Cisco 5500 series chassis is about 21 rack units (or about 3 feet) tall to give you an idea of the scale of these devices in the real world. They are also jam packed with custom ASICs that allow packet switching at extremely high speeds, which would need to be redesigned to handle 16…

So tell your vendor you expect them to have that redesign in 4 years.

Fat lot of good that will do you with your project that needs to be completed next year or your company is hosed no? And once you do the fix - which won’t require ipv6 or will use a different vendor - then you won’t be talking to them anyway.

The underlying issue is that there is a lot of momentum with v4, and hacks mostly work and work faster and easier, so most people end up going that way. So it keeps the momentum.

And v6 has some serious second system syndrome going on (aka we’ll dramatically fix all the stuff we wanted to do better last time, ignoring real world constraints), and the adoption shows. It was clearly designed to be a either or replacement (aka cleanroom, start fresh with this), but that’s not how real world upgrades tend to work. I keep wanting to use v6, but every time I do, it quickly ends up having to get turned off because of something broken somewhere in some product I have little choice in using or interacting with and v4 (even with tons of terrible NAT) still keeps chugging along.

Momentum is shifting of course - this isn’t a steady state forever thing - but man, ugh.

Re: Enabling IPv6 support for GitHub Pages

#60

Post by Forge36 »

wmf wrote: post #58
throw0101a wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It boggles my mind that IPv6 has such a slow roll out (it's been a thing since the early 2000s = twenty years ago). IPv4 had just as slow a roll out in some ways. TCP/IP had its flag day in 1983: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flag_day_(computing) There was early commercialization of the Internet around ±1990, but it didn't really start taking off until around 1994: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercializatio…

So it took 15 years to build the entire Internet from scratch but it's taking over 20 years to upgrade to a new version.

It is a lot bigger now. I wonder how much IPv6 growth is net new hardware vs replacing old hardware
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