Sounds like we need to start taxing the rich a lot more to pay it off.
US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
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Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
> My parents are in their 70's and they still have furniture that was (second hand) given to them when they got married. Can you imagine an piece of IKEA furniture being used daily and lasting for >40 years? Two answers: 1) Yes. Very, very easily. For at least some IKEA furniture. 2) I somehow doubt that second hand furniture was from the 'IKEA of that day'.
> I somehow doubt that second hand furniture was from the 'IKEA of that day'. I think that's the parent poster's point. Presumably his parents are not significantly wealthier in relative terms than he was, but they could afford more premium furniture than most people today do.
Well no they couldn't, it was given to them.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#23This is more a discussion of semantics than about the amount itself. The way I read the statistics is that the current debt is $28T of money that is already spent while the quoted debt of $146T is the amount of money needed to be spent to fill full current promises and expenses . It's interesting that since the USA got off the gold standard in 1971[1], and thereby all countries that had a currency backed by dollars,…
this is a good point. Everybody keep saying that US had a small inflation in the last 2 decades. Yes, prices of eggs/milk maybe didn't go up to0 much. But what about prices of child care, education, housing, health care, retirement. Yes all these have many factors behind their cost rise, but money printing just can't be ignored here.
The rest of the world has seen the same price increases.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#24The US National Debt being viewed like a bad loan is a load of BS - that's a sum invested and leveraged against the projected continued growth of the country and, honestly, nobody on earth has the ability to forcefully collect from the US government.
You can see this in their article on Chicago, too. https://www.truthinaccounting.org/news/detail/chicago-in-deb... "Chicago in debt despite balanced budget and federal aid" Well, yeah. I have a balanced household budget and a big mortgage (debt). It works fine.
You aren’t taking a new mortgage every year though.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can see this in their article on Chicago, too. https://www.truthinaccounting.org/news/detail/chicago-in-deb... "Chicago in debt despite balanced budget and federal aid" Well, yeah. I have a balanced household budget and a big mortgage (debt). It works fine.
You aren’t taking a new mortgage every year though.
Neither is Chicago.
"Chicago's annual revenue is $11 billion but its pension credit card debt is $33 billion."
Comparing annual revenue to total pension liabilities is silly.
(As is calling it "credit card debt" to make people think it's incurring 20% interest penalties. That's a deliberate choice to prompt a false impression when reading the article, IMO.)
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#26This is more a discussion of semantics than about the amount itself. The way I read the statistics is that the current debt is $28T of money that is already spent while the quoted debt of $146T is the amount of money needed to be spent to fill full current promises and expenses . It's interesting that since the USA got off the gold standard in 1971[1], and thereby all countries that had a currency backed by dollars,…
> Can you imagine an piece of IKEA furniture being used daily and lasting for >40 years?
Yeah. IKEA's not bad.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#27The US National Debt being viewed like a bad loan is a load of BS - that's a sum invested and leveraged against the projected continued growth of the country and, honestly, nobody on earth has the ability to forcefully collect from the US government.
As far as I understand it, it has nothing to do with creditor’s ability to collect but the interest future creditors will be willing to part with their money for.
With an institution even a fraction the size of the US federal government, I don’t think people can reasonably collect, and instead the incentive to take care of current creditors is to give future creditors confidence that their investment is safe. Historically this allows the US to borrow at very low rates.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#28Nobody cares anymore. People are working, resources are being extracted, created and traded, economies are rolling. Money is there to facilitate that, but on its own it's pretty much worthless. Just wish inequality wasn't so fucking huge.
Inequality will keep getting greater till businesses stop sleeping with the government AND the government stops handing out free money. Corporations, and that means executives, got fatter cause they lined their pockets with all that free covid money.
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#29This is more a discussion of semantics than about the amount itself. The way I read the statistics is that the current debt is $28T of money that is already spent while the quoted debt of $146T is the amount of money needed to be spent to fill full current promises and expenses . It's interesting that since the USA got off the gold standard in 1971[1], and thereby all countries that had a currency backed by dollars,…
> Everything is getting too expensive, and the only reason we don't feel this too much just yet, is because often times cheaper alternatives where available.
and because my LEAPS go up way more. They can increase the money supply by 40% and it won't matter when my LEAPS rise 10,000%
Don't forget, when "everything" goes up in value, so do stocks as well. Don't focus on the potential of Weimar bread lines, and look at the stock speculators who made baaaaaank! Its not an egalitarian system, play the cards you were dealt!
Re: US Published National Debt: $28T. The Truth: $146T. Each Taxpayer's Share: $951k
#30It's a misleading way of calculating the number, since it refers to all of the future debt obligations, including Social Security out many decades -- but also ignoring the fact that we'll be collecting taxes all that time.
It's a bit like concluding that you're a million dollars in debt because you are going to need to buy food for the rest of your life. I suppose it's true -- it is something you need to plan for. But it's misleading to suggest that it means you're automatically destined for bankruptcy.
The fact is that Social Security is in trouble: the pay-as-you-go plan doesn't work with an increasing lifespan. The establishment of the Trust Fund didn't really solve it -- it really just increased the size of the federal government without having to explicitly borrow money (and then still somehow managed to also have to explicitly borrow money).
But that doesn't make "$146T" a meaningful number. The meaningful number is 2033, the year Social Security is projected to run out of money. Also, conveniently, the year I qualify for Social Security -- this is something Gen X'ers have always expected, though it got worse during the pandemic.
That doesn't automatically mean we won't get anything, but it does mean that the government is going to have an even harder time meeting its obligations.