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iPhone remains findable after power off

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Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#171

Post by SilverRed »

fsckboy wrote: post #149
chewmieser wrote: post #8

Apple is very clear that this is how things work now. They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you of this change the first time you try to shut your device off - https://9to5mac.com/2021/06/07/ios-15-find-my-network-can-fi... I'm not sure why this is presented as some new thing, or a gotcha or whatever this is. We've known about it for months... And IMO, it's a positive change although it does sound a little…

> They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you slightly tangential, I hate being informed of things when I try to do them. I'm in a hurry, I don't want to read all about something now. I wish the dialogs had an "email this to me, willya?" selection, with an opportunity to decide the long term setting that I want.

Ultimately it doesn't really matter anyway. Unless you are the worlds most wanted criminal and Apple is working with the government to track you down via your turned off iphone. And in that case, you should have done your research to see this anyway.

If the average user blows past this message, it has no impact on their life.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#172

Post by SilverRed »

ElectronShak wrote: post #100
chewmieser wrote: post #8

Apple is very clear that this is how things work now. They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you of this change the first time you try to shut your device off - https://9to5mac.com/2021/06/07/ios-15-find-my-network-can-fi... I'm not sure why this is presented as some new thing, or a gotcha or whatever this is. We've known about it for months... And IMO, it's a positive change although it does sound a little…

I'm generally of the impression that any phone with an unremovable battery is never truly "off" at any given time, unless the battery is totally damaged. PS: I like phones whose batteries are removable, currently use a Nokia Android with a removable one. One advantage is that when the phone drops down, it disintegrates, frame from battery, decreasing the overall impact on the phone.

You can drop the phone in an RF blocking bag if you want to go off the grid.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#173

Post by sizzle »

wlesieutre wrote: post #55
hungryforcodes wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, first I've heard of it. Seems to be enabled by default too -- I think users definitely are not "clear" about it.

The "slide to power off" prompt literally says "iPhone Findable after Power Off >" right under it every time, but 99% of users will never see it or care about this feature because no one ever turns their phone off. But if you're one of those few people who does turn the phone off, it says right there, and you can tap on it to shut down to unfindable state this time instead. Note that it requires a passcode to disable…

defeated by a $5 wrench attack à la XKCD

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#174

Post by SilverRed »

MerelyMortal wrote: post #56
rjh29 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an obvious trend on HN turning against Apple since the image hash stuff. Search 'Apple' in the last month and you'll see stories about Apple screwing over blind people, copying other people's ideas, screwing over employees, removing apps from the app store, disabling FaceID if you try to change the screen etc. From my POV (a non-Apple user) they have not changed, they have always been pretty anti-consumer. B…

It's helping show people that "they have always been pretty anti-consumer".

Almost all of the digs at Apple have been things that apply industry wide and it is an interesting observation. There was one recently worded something like "EU to require Apple to update phones for 7 years" but if you look at the actual proposal, it applies to all phone makers and Apple is the only one anywhere close to compliant to this proposal.

Other scandals like Samsung disabling the cameras when unlocking the boot loader go practically unnoticed. Almost everything said about Apple is true and I don't dispute that, but people seem to believe that Apple is the only one using questionable labor, gluing in batteries, or applying software restrictions when it's basically industry standard right now.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#175

Post by sizzle »

defaultname wrote: post #32
AndrewStephens wrote: post #2

Umm, isn’t this, like maybe, a good thing? If I want my very expensive iPhone found, I want it found whether it is on or off. If people are worried about being tracked maybe they should carry around a device that is always broadcasting radio signals to third party towers.

For the vast majority of people in the vast majority of situations, it's a very good thing and is ideal behavior. It is only in conspiratorial "but what if nation states are tracking me" noise that this is cast as a bad thing.

Big GDP nation states have teams harvesting 0-days around the clock and can go above the law to insider negotiate or bruteforce backdoors for this 'always on' functionality I'd imagine (what company can say no to the highest levels of government interference?), regardless of if it is offered to the public or not as a new 'feature' for their benefit.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#176

Post by SilverRed »

defaultname wrote: post #32
AndrewStephens wrote: post #2

Umm, isn’t this, like maybe, a good thing? If I want my very expensive iPhone found, I want it found whether it is on or off. If people are worried about being tracked maybe they should carry around a device that is always broadcasting radio signals to third party towers.

For the vast majority of people in the vast majority of situations, it's a very good thing and is ideal behavior. It is only in conspiratorial "but what if nation states are tracking me" noise that this is cast as a bad thing.

And for those people, you can turn that setting off. It even warns you about it on the power off screen. If you don't trust the setting to actually turn off, then you shouldn't trust anything about the phone and should smash it up with a hammer.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#177

Post by SilverRed »

sudosysgen wrote: post #91

If someone steals your phone all they have to do so you won't find it is to wrap it in aluminium foil.

It's just another barrier. With enough hassle, people will move to stealing other easier things. When find my was released, phone theft went down massively. Not every criminal wants to make the jump from just grabbing a phone off the table, to having an RF blocking bag, transporting to an RF proof room, and then pulling the phone to bits to sell for pennies since the parts don't work properly when swapped in to another phone.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#178

Post by Jtsummers »

fsckboy wrote: post #149
chewmieser wrote: post #8

Apple is very clear that this is how things work now. They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you of this change the first time you try to shut your device off - https://9to5mac.com/2021/06/07/ios-15-find-my-network-can-fi... I'm not sure why this is presented as some new thing, or a gotcha or whatever this is. We've known about it for months... And IMO, it's a positive change although it does sound a little…

> They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you slightly tangential, I hate being informed of things when I try to do them. I'm in a hurry, I don't want to read all about something now. I wish the dialogs had an "email this to me, willya?" selection, with an opportunity to decide the long term setting that I want.

In this case, there's a bit of extra text that is clearly clickable (has the now standard arrow to the right indicating there's something more). Then there's a dialog box describing the system and two choices: OK, Temporarily Turn Off Finding.

The modal dialog could be replaced with a toggle on the same screen as the power off slider in place of that text, and maybe one day it will be. But right now, since the feature is novel, it's probably worth it to have the extra bit of text so people know what the options are that they're selecting between. As far as slowing you down, you're shutting down your phone. If you only want to temporarily turn this off, yes, you're slowed down by about 0.5 seconds But if you are really concerned about this feature you've also had opportunities while using the phone to disable it so that it is permanently off in which case you can just use the power off slider and be done with it.

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#179

Post by fzzzy »

fsckboy wrote: post #149
chewmieser wrote: post #8

Apple is very clear that this is how things work now. They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you of this change the first time you try to shut your device off - https://9to5mac.com/2021/06/07/ios-15-find-my-network-can-fi... I'm not sure why this is presented as some new thing, or a gotcha or whatever this is. We've known about it for months... And IMO, it's a positive change although it does sound a little…

> They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you slightly tangential, I hate being informed of things when I try to do them. I'm in a hurry, I don't want to read all about something now. I wish the dialogs had an "email this to me, willya?" selection, with an opportunity to decide the long term setting that I want.

take a screenshot

Re: iPhone remains findable after power off

#180

Post by arctics »

madeofpalk wrote: post #12
chewmieser wrote: post #8

Apple is very clear that this is how things work now. They even give you a dialog prompt now to inform you of this change the first time you try to shut your device off - https://9to5mac.com/2021/06/07/ios-15-find-my-network-can-fi... I'm not sure why this is presented as some new thing, or a gotcha or whatever this is. We've known about it for months... And IMO, it's a positive change although it does sound a little…

Yeah, there's a reasonably visible message "warning" you of this, which has a prompt to turn it off. I actually thought this was very old, added a year or so ago. I guess it got delayed? I've had two phones stolen (right out of my hands) that were immediately shut down and sim cards ejected to prevent them from being tracked. While I'm sure this feature wouldn't help me get back a phone, I hope it does deter this. Ed…

someone can just wrap your phone in aluminum foil, bye bye phone.
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