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YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

washingtonpost.com

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Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#91

Post by afavour »

IgorPartola wrote: post #53
afavour wrote: post #40

Time for repeat showing of the free speech debate we’ve already had a dozen times, whoopee! As ever, IMO, the problem isn’t the hosting or the banning, it’s the algorithms. I don’t care whether YouTube hosts anti-vaccine activists, I care that they actively promote anti-vaccine content to users simply because it’s proven to get clicks and earn them money. Bans like this look incredibly stupid when you realise YouTube…

Let me reframe: let’s say that YouTube hosts anti-vax content and as a result some percentage of people are swayed by this content to not vaccinate themselves or their children. Some percentage of them dies. Let’s say in absolute numbers it is 10,000 people. Do you think that YouTube did a good thing by allowing that content?

IMO one of the reasons these debates go back and forth forever is because it’s impossible to come up hard and fast rules that cover every scenario.

Maybe a poorly thought out analogy but think about cars. There are a ton of car accidents every year, a good number of which result in death. But we don’t ban cars because they’re essential for the way many people live. But if 50% of all car journeys resulted in accidents? Maybe we’d be having a different conversation.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#93

Post by mach1ne »

IgorPartola wrote: post #76
mach1ne wrote: post #57

People don't see what the actual problem here is - perhaps because they don't want to see. What is happening is very much the transformation from an open society to one where freedom of speech is limited and certain other individual rights are stripped away. Perhaps not de jure, but de facto. And sure, one might argue that it's for a good cause (even though it's a complex topic). However, the fact is that as this is…

Yes our freedoms are being eroded. It’s a slippery slope. All that bullshit. Come on. A private company doesn’t want to contribute to people dying. Oh and by the way don’t they have the right to do what they want? You want what, regulation to prohibit this?

When a private company with a market share of information as large as Youtube acts as an arbitrer of truth, regulation to prevent this would be nice, yes.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#94

Post by VikingCoder »

afavour wrote: post #40

Time for repeat showing of the free speech debate we’ve already had a dozen times, whoopee! As ever, IMO, the problem isn’t the hosting or the banning, it’s the algorithms. I don’t care whether YouTube hosts anti-vaccine activists, I care that they actively promote anti-vaccine content to users simply because it’s proven to get clicks and earn them money. Bans like this look incredibly stupid when you realise YouTube…

Not entirely true. If it's hosted on YouTube and then goes viral on Twitter or Facebook...

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#95

Post by chmsky00 »

afavour wrote: post #40

Time for repeat showing of the free speech debate we’ve already had a dozen times, whoopee! As ever, IMO, the problem isn’t the hosting or the banning, it’s the algorithms. I don’t care whether YouTube hosts anti-vaccine activists, I care that they actively promote anti-vaccine content to users simply because it’s proven to get clicks and earn them money. Bans like this look incredibly stupid when you realise YouTube…

The stupid information is still out there.

It’s just not on YouTube.

We don’t live in the reality where the local book store and media owner keeping information away actually had an impact.

This only effects YouTube. Of the millions of other sites out there.

I think even the smart people are a bit stuck on YouTubes marketing effects on their limbic brain versus the reality; the bad info is just a Google search or friend posting in private away for anyone still.

YouTube is not the center of the internet.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#96

Post by ookblah »

mariodiana wrote: post #73
ookblah wrote: post #50

Someone want to throw out there a better way to combat disinformation than just armchair criticizing their decision? I almost feel like people are siding with the anti-vaxxers out of "principle". Just a no win situation. It's too easy for bad characters to screw up an entire system with little effort (look at trolls, spammers, etc). Either you moderate everyone and slippery slope down into censorship where the tools…

"Misinformation" should not be combatted by anything other than better, more persuasive information.

Great in theory, but if you've ever debated someone who is not acting in good faith online it's near impossible. Their energy input is an order of magnitude lower than yours. And yes, in this specific context it IS misinformation, disinformation, or just flat out false.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#97

Post by tsfranke »

ookblah wrote: post #50

Someone want to throw out there a better way to combat disinformation than just armchair criticizing their decision? I almost feel like people are siding with the anti-vaxxers out of "principle". Just a no win situation. It's too easy for bad characters to screw up an entire system with little effort (look at trolls, spammers, etc). Either you moderate everyone and slippery slope down into censorship where the tools…

Agree completely on a no win situation.

Censorship can keep good information out.

No censorship can make whoever yells the loudest be the most heard, which can snowball into millions of ramifications.

I'd like to go back to the early internet days where people had to at least make a geocities site to spread their word, with no financial incentives to getting more clicks or viewers. It wasn't perfect, but you had to be seeking that group / audience rather than having it thrown in your face everywhere.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#98

Post by vibrato2 »

afavour wrote: post #40

Time for repeat showing of the free speech debate we’ve already had a dozen times, whoopee! As ever, IMO, the problem isn’t the hosting or the banning, it’s the algorithms. I don’t care whether YouTube hosts anti-vaccine activists, I care that they actively promote anti-vaccine content to users simply because it’s proven to get clicks and earn them money. Bans like this look incredibly stupid when you realise YouTube…

The only disinformation I've seen about these vaccines has been from Fauci and other pro vaxxers.

“You’re not going to get COVID if you have these vaccinations.” - Joe Biden

there was never a basis for this statement, making it clear disinformation. Grass roots research doesn't fit the bill of what that word means.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#99

Post by seqastian »

mariodiana wrote: post #73
ookblah wrote: post #50

Someone want to throw out there a better way to combat disinformation than just armchair criticizing their decision? I almost feel like people are siding with the anti-vaxxers out of "principle". Just a no win situation. It's too easy for bad characters to screw up an entire system with little effort (look at trolls, spammers, etc). Either you moderate everyone and slippery slope down into censorship where the tools…

"Misinformation" should not be combatted by anything other than better, more persuasive information.

Too bad that is not how humans work. If the good information is complicated and scary, we will go for easy and pleasing every time.

Re: YouTube is banning anti-vaccine activists and blocking all anti-vaccine content

#100

Post by z3ncyberpunk »

ookblah wrote: post #50

Someone want to throw out there a better way to combat disinformation than just armchair criticizing their decision? I almost feel like people are siding with the anti-vaxxers out of "principle". Just a no win situation. It's too easy for bad characters to screw up an entire system with little effort (look at trolls, spammers, etc). Either you moderate everyone and slippery slope down into censorship where the tools…

...or you just do some actual moderating instead of offloading your workload on machines. People worry about idiots and disinformation yet ignore and allow way more non conspiracy nutjobs all the time. Big Tech has such a cognitive dissonance its dizzying
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