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Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

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Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#41
post #23

It is really worth it to switch to DuckDuckGo. You can throw a g! at the end of your search if you don't like the results DDG gave and it will redirect you to Google. That was the feature that gave me the confidence to switch over, it's painless to get different results, even on a mobile keyboard.

Or use startpage.com which has Google search results.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#42
post #14
post #11

Google does this so they have click tracking data. But they don't need to mangle URLs in Chrome because it supports the `ping` attribute on tags [0]. The ping attribute basically adds click tracking as a native browser feature so you don't need to do URL redirects. It also makes these analytics much easier for the site and mysterious to the user. Looks like most vendors besides Firefox support it. (They were pretty o…

Firefox has a browser.send_pings setting to control this, not sending any pings when it is set to false. This is explicitly a valid browser implementation of the ping attribute: https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/links.html#hyperlink-... > 2. Optionally, return. (For example, the user agent might wish to ignore any or all ping URLs in accordance with the user's expressed preferences.) The problem isn't that Firef…

Seems like it's set to false by default. So it's not really a "user request" not to track so much as a "browser request" not to. Reminds me of the situation with the "Do Not Track" header where browsers sending it by default caused the signal to lose all meaning.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#43
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s also a notable DDoS amplification vector[1]. [1]: https://securityaffairs.co/wordpress/83890/hacking/ddos-html...

I'm confused as to why ping was used in that situation at all, rather than, for example, just a normal POST request.

Doesn't require running javascript, so presumably the devices could be more efficient in sending them versus XHR/fetch.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#44
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm confused as to why ping was used in that situation at all, rather than, for example, just a normal POST request.

Doesn't require running javascript, so presumably the devices could be more efficient in sending them versus XHR/fetch.

The article specifically says the offending pages used JavaScript to add the ping attribute to the tags, so the attack wouldn't have worked against users with JS disabled anyway.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#45
post #23

It is really worth it to switch to DuckDuckGo. You can throw a g! at the end of your search if you don't like the results DDG gave and it will redirect you to Google. That was the feature that gave me the confidence to switch over, it's painless to get different results, even on a mobile keyboard.

DDG user here, I’m not even sure most people would need g! anymore. I recently came across a Google search results page, and was surprised how unrecognizable it has become. Instead of giving me a page full of search results, it was presenting me with a page full of Google-curated content. At this point, Google is basically unusable for me as a search engine.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#46
post #11

Google does this so they have click tracking data. But they don't need to mangle URLs in Chrome because it supports the `ping` attribute on tags [0]. The ping attribute basically adds click tracking as a native browser feature so you don't need to do URL redirects. It also makes these analytics much easier for the site and mysterious to the user. Looks like most vendors besides Firefox support it. (They were pretty o…

Note the caniuse link says "While still in the WHATWG specification, this feature was removed from the W3C HTML5 specification in 2010." Another reason I prefer Firefox. Why implement a rejected non-standard feature whose primary purpose is to enable surveillance?

> Why implement a rejected non-standard feature whose primary purpose is to enable surveillance?

Something that's in the spec that matters (WHATWG) but not the one that desperately pretends to still have relevance for HTML though it hasn't since it tried to push XHTML 2 (W3C) isn't “rejected” or “nonstandard” in any meaningful sense.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Note the caniuse link says "While still in the WHATWG specification, this feature was removed from the W3C HTML5 specification in 2010." Another reason I prefer Firefox. Why implement a rejected non-standard feature whose primary purpose is to enable surveillance?

> whose primary purpose is to enable surveillance Google search is good because it tracks what links people click and knows when they come back to go to a different url on the page. if 99% of people visit the top result for a query, return, then hit the second one, chances are that the top result never answers what the search query asks.

> Google search is good because

Google search might have been good over a decade ago but today it's trash.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#48
post #11

Google does this so they have click tracking data. But they don't need to mangle URLs in Chrome because it supports the `ping` attribute on tags [0]. The ping attribute basically adds click tracking as a native browser feature so you don't need to do URL redirects. It also makes these analytics much easier for the site and mysterious to the user. Looks like most vendors besides Firefox support it. (They were pretty o…

Support for the ping attribute is one of the several reasons why I don't use Chrome/Chromium.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#49
post #42
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox has a browser.send_pings setting to control this, not sending any pings when it is set to false. This is explicitly a valid browser implementation of the ping attribute: https://html.spec.whatwg.org/multipage/links.html#hyperlink-... > 2. Optionally, return. (For example, the user agent might wish to ignore any or all ping URLs in accordance with the user's expressed preferences.) The problem isn't that Firef…

Seems like it's set to false by default. So it's not really a "user request" not to track so much as a "browser request" not to. Reminds me of the situation with the "Do Not Track" header where browsers sending it by default caused the signal to lose all meaning.

That wasn't what caused DNT to fail. What caused it to fail was that websites could decide whether or not to honor it, and honoring it would have meant a reduced ability to spy on people, impacting their income.

Re: Prevent Google from mangling search result links when click/copying on Firefox

#50
they've been doing this for a very long time. didn't know about this ping attribute for anchors though.

i always just assumed it was for improving the index. the more a result gets clicked, the more relevant it must be.

it's kind of a zero'th order optimization.

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