Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

telegra.ph

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 179 posts

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#141

Post by ryanlol »

kitkat_new wrote: post #140
ryanlol wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Element and the Matrix protocol situated in authoritarian countries, how can they disagree Anyway, no, this doesn’t reflect real usage.

Matrix servers can be hosted by anyone and conversations are decentralized, i.e. can't be taken down easily. the Matrix protocol is accessible to anyone understanding English and having access to the web. It is even being worked on enabling P2P with Matrix, i.e. each client can spin up a local server that communicates with others (servers) via Bluetooth and other means of transports even if there is not a direct conn…

Doesn’t mean that it’s anywhere near widely enough used to be the “most trusted”.

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#142

Post by kitkat_new »

ryanlol wrote: post #141
kitkat_new wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Matrix servers can be hosted by anyone and conversations are decentralized, i.e. can't be taken down easily. the Matrix protocol is accessible to anyone understanding English and having access to the web. It is even being worked on enabling P2P with Matrix, i.e. each client can spin up a local server that communicates with others (servers) via Bluetooth and other means of transports even if there is not a direct conn…

Doesn’t mean that it’s anywhere near widely enough used to be the “most trusted”.

but it shows that your argumentation to show that it wouldn't be is flawed, and it is certainly possible that more trust is put in Matrix than it is into Signal

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#143

Post by ryanlol »

kitkat_new wrote: post #142
ryanlol wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn’t mean that it’s anywhere near widely enough used to be the “most trusted”.

but it shows that your argumentation to show that it wouldn't be is flawed, and it is certainly possible that more trust is put in Matrix than it is into Signal

I’m not saying that it couldn’t be, I’m saying that it isn’t.

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#144

Post by kitkat_new »

ryanlol wrote: post #143
kitkat_new wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

but it shows that your argumentation to show that it wouldn't be is flawed, and it is certainly possible that more trust is put in Matrix than it is into Signal

I’m not saying that it couldn’t be, I’m saying that it isn’t.

I am not saying it could become either.

Saying that it isn't is a bold claim to be backed up by proper arguments

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#145

Post by irl_chad »

skinkestek wrote: post #137
seniorivn wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>and buyers of those bonds are affiliated with Russia structures like VTB Capital bank or Russian Government investment fund named “Russian Fund of Direct Investments”. As far as i know, it's not true(meaning there are no signs/proof of that). It's entirely possible, durov does have connections in russian elite, after all he was the creator of vk.com russian most popular social network. Vk was owned by russian oligar…

> End of TON project, ment an end of telegram's future as a not data harvesting company. Durov can ask any day of the month for a donation and I'll give it as soon as I have money in hand. $10 - $100, no problem, more in 6 months. In fact even if he bust released a dumb sticker collection I'd buy it just to support Telegram even if I don't use stickers. I guess this holds true for many other ex-Whatsapp enthusiasts a…

I completely agree with you.

In my country, we use telegram to communicate, rather than WhatsApp or SMS. Older people might use Viber, but Viber is a total nightmare. Just having it installed, I get dozens of spam messages per week from shops where I’ve bought things.

SMS is very expensive here.

Comparing telegram to WhatsApp or other competing apps isn’t even worth doing - there is no other app as user friendly or as functional and well thought out as telegram. It’s niche features like scheduled messages are a Godsend.

During the events of Jan 6, I was very worried that Apple would pull TG from the App Store. Thankfully they didn’t, but it’s not white supremicist groups that they would be hurting - it’s ordinary young people in foreign countries.

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#146

Post by ryanlol »

kitkat_new wrote: post #144
ryanlol wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m not saying that it couldn’t be, I’m saying that it isn’t.

I am not saying it could become either. Saying that it isn't is a bold claim to be backed up by proper arguments

The original claim is the one which requires evidence, much harder to prove a negative.

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#147

Post by krageon »

kitkat_new wrote: post #136
vfclists wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dendrite is their own project. Conduit is the project of another guy they don't get on with it. The Python server is a memory hog, and instead of rewriting it in a more performant language they have decided to scale horizontally instead. How is that feasible for the average guy who wants to run it on the their own server? https://matrix.org/blog/2020/11/03/how-we-fixed-synapses-sca... https://news.ycombinator.com/ite…

> and instead of rewriting it in a more performant language they have decided to scale horizontally instead. Dendrite is literally rewriting it in a more performant language > How is that feasible for the average guy who wants to run it on the their own server? The average guy likely doesn't host for thousands of people

> The average guy likely doesn't host for thousands of people

The python server already has trouble if you subscribe to large rooms. I'm all for promoting Matrix (it's a great project), but the default server has warts and nobody is served by trying to hide them.

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#148

Post by immapotato »

afroboy wrote: post #126
0xy wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal made their server code closed source for over a year while they added a scam cryptocurrency coin that has a financial conflict of interest with the creator of the project. They claimed to be "open source" while this was happening. More recently, they've had egregious bugs such as images being sent to random contacts in your list, an absolutely inexcusable error.

But the server code doesn't mean anything the most important thing is E2EE happen on device and the server is just a messenger. Signal is the most trusted app in authoritarian countries.

No it's not. When Belarus had it's internet blackout last summer, Telegram was the only option to communicate to the outside world. Multiple persons asked if Signal is going to do anything about it, like enable censorship circumvention but it was never addressed[1].

PS. Check the comment section of the tweet.

[1] https://twitter.com/signalapp/status/1293377583891980293?lan...

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#149

Post by gefhfff »

krageon wrote: post #147
kitkat_new wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and instead of rewriting it in a more performant language they have decided to scale horizontally instead. Dendrite is literally rewriting it in a more performant language > How is that feasible for the average guy who wants to run it on the their own server? The average guy likely doesn't host for thousands of people

> The average guy likely doesn't host for thousands of people The python server already has trouble if you subscribe to large rooms. I'm all for promoting Matrix (it's a great project), but the default server has warts and nobody is served by trying to hide them.

Trouble in the sense that the most resource intensive room makes Synapse use about 700 mb of RAM

Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app

#150

Post by joshxyz »

Aachen wrote: post #103
cunidev wrote: post #70

While Telegram is seen as a "wild west" of free speech by many, its centralization and worrying lack of encryption for most "non-secret" chats is something to keep in mind when reading Durov's passionate claims. - https://www.wired.com/story/telegram-encryption-whatsapp-set... - https://portswigger.net/daily-swig/amp/multiple-encryption-f... Also, the optional E2EE encryption is way more limited (e.g., single-device,…

I doubt many here are still under the illusion that Telegram has anything to do with security or encrypted messaging. (It's just too damn convenient for UX reasons.) That's not the same as a "wild west of free speech", though. I have no idea how well they do on the front of censorship, they're way too intransparent an organisation for that, but the USA also sees itself as such and it is not encrypted. Secure protocol…

Same here. Great user experience and developer experience too (compaire their bot api to other platforms).
Post reply on HN