Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
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Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#2There was recently comments about this with questionable reasoning. There is an official statement now so everyone can make their own educated opinion.
Please don't start a "telegram is not encrypted by default" shitstorm like in every other comment section about anything related to Telegram.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#3> First, without support from Apple and Google, any fight with a local regulator is lost before it starts ... Our website that hosts Telegram Web and the standalone Telegram app for Android would be blocked by local telecoms in a matter of minutes. Even existing users would lose access to Telegram once Apple and Google turn off notifications for the app (which are used not only to deliver messages to users, but also to distribute unblocked IP addresses and dodge censorship).
> Some users wish Telegram was 100% independent from everyone and could ignore Apple, Google and national laws of all countries. I also wish it was possible. But the reality we live in is different. I have warned the public many times of the danger that the Apple/Google duopoly poses for freedom of speech. And, as I wrote in August, the world is becoming more pro-censorship in general, with even democratic countries changing their definitions of free speech due to concerns of election interference from geopolitical rivals.
This is the main issue - BigTech have grown too big and have too much influence now on politics since the US decided to sub-contract intelligence gathering and surveillance to them (as Snowden revealed). The author is right that democratic countries are now increasingly becoming pro-censorship and have an anti-privacy attitude.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#4This is why apps suck.
Steve Jobs got us into this mess by trying to monopolize the iPhone processor (and only allowed the web to bootstrap his platform). Complete control can be strong armed by dictators, and our spineless capitalists will bend to their will.
The W3C needs to develop a standard for non-DOM, immediate mode painted, fully WASM apps that can access all of a device's hardware. Storage, cameras, network, GPS, multithreading, gyros, all of it. Native apps over web.
We need a web-based drive by app that we can run sandboxed and install without the Apple/Google duopoly, and the US, EU, and Asia need to mandate support.
Edit: downvoters, seriously, we need to talk. You're walking the evil line.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#5Second, this particular demand of the Russian authorities wasn't obviously unconstitutional, as they referred to a law that restricts campaigning after people start casting their votes.
The problem is that according to the recent federal law - campaigning ban does not apply in case when voting lasts for several days.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#6There was recently comments about this with questionable reasoning. There is an official statement now so everyone can make their own educated opinion. Please don't start a "telegram is not encrypted by default" shitstorm like in every other comment section about anything related to Telegram.
100% this. People sitting in their WhatsApps and Facebook messangers, not understanding why someone would like to use a better chat client because it's actually better, and also because your data doesn't end up at Google or Facebook.
Probably ends up at the nsa though. But I care more about not being a product of Google.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#7As HN'sers would say, "Google/Apple are private companies and allowed to deplatform whomever they wish. Just start your own App Store"
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#8There was recently comments about this with questionable reasoning. There is an official statement now so everyone can make their own educated opinion. Please don't start a "telegram is not encrypted by default" shitstorm like in every other comment section about anything related to Telegram.
I think for open group chats it doesn't really matter. Because anyone can join anyway. Nobody complains that IRC isn't E2E encrypted and still many people use it every day :) That usecase doesn't benefit from it at all.
For closed (invite only) group chats and 1:1 chats I think it should be encrypted by default though. Like WA and Signal. There's the secret chats of course but they only work on one device and not on group chats. Of course key management is hard in those cases but the others have worked around this very well.
I agree that encryption issue doesn't really have any bearing on this bot ban though. This thing wasn't really about surveillance. But the best way to make this appear in the comments is Telegram fixing it :)
Edit: FWIW I really like Telegram because they're open to integration with other networks (eg Matrix) and that they actually allow and embrace bots. But it would be so much better if they did have E2E.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#9This is why apps suck. Steve Jobs got us into this mess by trying to monopolize the iPhone processor (and only allowed the web to bootstrap his platform). Complete control can be strong armed by dictators, and our spineless capitalists will bend to their will. The W3C needs to develop a standard for non-DOM, immediate mode painted, fully WASM apps that can access all of a device's hardware. Storage, cameras, network,…
Totally agree. Web apps are actually more efficient in the long run because there are so many apps people use infrequently and yet use storage and receive updates.
Re: Why Telegram had to follow Apple and Google when they suspended a voting app
#10> First, without support from Apple and Google, any fight with a local regulator is lost before it starts ... Our website that hosts Telegram Web and the standalone Telegram app for Android would be blocked by local telecoms in a matter of minutes. Even existing users would lose access to Telegram once Apple and Google turn off notifications for the app (which are used not only to deliver messages to users, but also…
Who is downvoting you?
We should never support censorship or the erosion of privacy. Preservation of these two is essential for our democracy and freedom.