A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas • Hacker News Board

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#111

Post by stormdennis » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:23 AM UTC

joecot wrote: post #32

jmchuster wrote: post #19

> But it could help explain why Columbus, a Genoese, was prepared to set off across what most contemporaries considered a landless void. I had always thought that Columbus made the trip because he miscalculated the distance around the globe, while everyone else was saying they'd starve before reaching Asia. He was just lucky enough there happened to be land halfway there, and then mistakenly assumed he made it, since…

Columbus thought India was closer than it was because birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere . Portugal, Spain and anyone else he asked thought he was wrong because that would've required the Earth to be around 20k miles in circumference, when the Ancient Greeks had calculated it to be 24k miles in circumference (and they were very close in their calculations).…

Ireland is an island lying less than 100 miles west of England.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#112

Post by weswpg » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:24 AM UTC

kevinmchugh wrote: post #80

joecot wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Columbus thought India was closer than it was because birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere . Portugal, Spain and anyone else he asked thought he was wrong because that would've required the Earth to be around 20k miles in circumference, when the Ancient Greeks had calculated it to be 24k miles in circumference (and they were very close in their calculations).…

Isn't the land west of England just...Ireland?

Again, Columbus was not a very clever man.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#113

Post by httgp » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:25 AM UTC

sfblah wrote: post #110

crakenzak wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere. Are you saying birds were carrying twigs over the Atlantic from Americas -> Europe?? Genuinely curious as to if birds actually do that, seems pointless.

I mean, the real question is whether they carried any coconuts.

That, and if they were African or European.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#114

Post by weswpg » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:26 AM UTC

dboreham wrote: post #103

jmchuster wrote: post #19

> But it could help explain why Columbus, a Genoese, was prepared to set off across what most contemporaries considered a landless void. I had always thought that Columbus made the trip because he miscalculated the distance around the globe, while everyone else was saying they'd starve before reaching Asia. He was just lucky enough there happened to be land halfway there, and then mistakenly assumed he made it, since…

Probably fake history. Modern thinking is that Columbus had a pretty good idea where he was going because others had already been there.

Why is the area referred to as "the west Indies" unless he thought it was India

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#115

Post by comex » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:28 AM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #106

crakenzak wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere. Are you saying birds were carrying twigs over the Atlantic from Americas -> Europe?? Genuinely curious as to if birds actually do that, seems pointless.

It doesn't matter whether the birds did or didn't. What matters is that people of the time thought birds were bringing in sticks from somewhere west. People believed there was a land out there. Whether or not the observations behind those beliefs are credible doesn't take away from the fact of their believing there was a land to find.

It doesn’t matter, but it’s interesting.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#116

Post by riffraff » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:30 AM UTC

crakenzak wrote: post #36

joecot wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Columbus thought India was closer than it was because birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere . Portugal, Spain and anyone else he asked thought he was wrong because that would've required the Earth to be around 20k miles in circumference, when the Ancient Greeks had calculated it to be 24k miles in circumference (and they were very close in their calculations).…

> birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere. Are you saying birds were carrying twigs over the Atlantic from Americas -> Europe?? Genuinely curious as to if birds actually do that, seems pointless.

Barnacle goose do migrate from Greenland to the British isles, but I do not know if Greenland is considered north America.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#117

Post by zeteo » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:31 AM UTC

jmchuster wrote: post #19

> But it could help explain why Columbus, a Genoese, was prepared to set off across what most contemporaries considered a landless void. I had always thought that Columbus made the trip because he miscalculated the distance around the globe, while everyone else was saying they'd starve before reaching Asia. He was just lucky enough there happened to be land halfway there, and then mistakenly assumed he made it, since…

I always find it fascinating that people are so much more interested in why he sailed for America rather than how. Columbus was a navigator, not a geographer. His true discovery was not America (which plenty of people, including some Europeans, had reached before) but the replicable transatlantic voyage.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#118

Post by jamiek88 » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:35 AM UTC

sfblah wrote: post #110

crakenzak wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> birds could be seen returning to the West Coast of England with twigs and leaves from somewhere. Are you saying birds were carrying twigs over the Atlantic from Americas -> Europe?? Genuinely curious as to if birds actually do that, seems pointless.

I mean, the real question is whether they carried any coconuts.

Fully laden you say?

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#119

Post by kitd » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:37 AM UTC

CryptoPunk wrote: post #39

Intriguely, Columbus claimed that in 1477, after visiting Bristol, England (which is confirmed), he visited Iceland, where the stories of Markland would have predominated.

And Bristol fishermen were known to fish Icelandic waters and beyond.

A major backer of their voyages was Welshman Richard ap Meryk, sometimes elided to Ameryk. There's a theory that the fishermen established a processing station in Newfoundland and called it Ameryka in his honour, associating the left-hand side of the pond with that name in voyagers and cartographers minds.

Re: A monk in 14th-century Italy wrote about the Americas

#120

Post by santiagobasulto » Sat, Sep 25, 2021, 6:43 AM UTC

throw0101a wrote: post #34

jmchuster wrote: post #19

> But it could help explain why Columbus, a Genoese, was prepared to set off across what most contemporaries considered a landless void. I had always thought that Columbus made the trip because he miscalculated the distance around the globe, while everyone else was saying they'd starve before reaching Asia. He was just lucky enough there happened to be land halfway there, and then mistakenly assumed he made it, since…

> I had always thought that Columbus made the trip because he miscalculated the distance around the globe, while everyone else was saying they'd starve before reaching Asia. In the late 1400s people thought the Asian continent was larger than it is in reality. So when Columbus et co saw islands they thought they had hit Japan†… roughly where all the best maps of the day said it would be. See Toscanelli's 1474 map, wh…

It's interesting that in Toscanelli's map it also appears the "Antillia"[0] island mentioned in another comment. There was definitively some knowledge of land in between, maybe they just didn't know it was a huge continent.

[0] https://wikipedia.org/wiki/Antillia