Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

theintercept.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

191–200 of 494 posts

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#191

Post by jhgb »

createdapril24 wrote: post #143
lamontcg wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But at the end of the day you have zero evidence of any of that actually happened. The backbone doesn't exist, the spike doesn't exist, the effort necessary to culture that completely unknown virus in the lab isn't documented anywhere. And the grant proposal very specifically is concerned with using the WIV1 and SHC014 backbones, nothing related to SARS-CoV-2. And going from sequence to live culturable virus that you…

The specific claims here that are most compelling to me are: "The grant proposal very specifically is concerned with using the WIV1 and SHC014 backbones, nothing related to SARS-CoV-2." The counterargument is "Well, they could have altered the proposal when they pursued funding elsewhere." The takeaway is that it is not likely this specific proposal was funded elsewhere, leading to SARS-CoV-2. "If they actually carri…

> The counterargument is "Well, they could have altered the proposal when they pursued funding elsewhere." The takeaway is that it is not likely this specific proposal was funded elsewhere, leading to SARS-CoV-2.

That sounds like a very tenuous line of reasoning to me. Almost like saying "We know that Mr. A proposed shooting Mr. B, so let's reconsider that Mr C. may have stabbed Mr. D."

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#193

Post by newswasboring »

endisneigh wrote: post #109
sayonaraman wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

you mean figuring out what caused a global pandemic, deaths of millions of people and trillions dollars of economic damage is of no consequence?

if we figure out, what then? Are they to blame for all the death?

Yes absolutely. If someone engineered something so deadly in a lab, in a non war political climate, and can be so irresponsible as to leak it and cause all this death then yes. They are absolutely responsible.

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#195

Post by rhino369 »

somewhereoutth wrote: post #150

Fairytales about lab leaks won't absolve us of our abject failure to deal with this novel pathogen, nor will they help us prepare for the next.

Refusal to investigate whether this is the biggest disaster in scientific history is odd.

If dangerous research killed 15 million people we need to know.

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#196

Post by throwawaysea »

roca wrote: post #71

Daszak should be compelled to reveal everything he knows and all relevant evidence --- all proposals, all emails, all files, any other documentation. I'm mystified why this hasn't already happened. I mean, his career depends on government largesse so it shouldn't even require coercion. Full cooperation or no cash.

It’s not just Daszak. The NIH itself has refused to cooperate with members of Congress who’ve called for transparency. I’m not sure why the Biden administration is OK with agencies being secretive about something that like this that clearly deserves public scrutiny: https://www.newsweek.com/its-time-nih-transparency-wuhan-res...

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#197

Post by throwawaysea »

baja_blast wrote: post #12
chrsw wrote: post #7

I could be missing something but this isn't exactly the smoking gun the title makes it seem. I'm sure there are proposals, plans and applications for all types of things. What I'm waiting for, perhaps naively, is strong evidence, revelated an independent investigation, that there was some foul business going on here. Until I see that, I'm more inclined to rely on the word of experts who have no connection to any of t…

there will never be an independent investigation

This is correct. China delayed a site visit for more than a year. And then when it happened they controlled what was said. And on top of that the only US representative was Daszak, since the WHO rejected a few other candidates from the Trump administration and picked someone who was seemingly favorable to the outcome they (or perhaps China?) desired. It is incredible that all these countries around the world didn’t immediately implement sanctions and a maritime blockade after such obviously untrustworthy actions in an incident that has led to hundreds of thousands of deaths.

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#198

Post by throwawaysea »

sjwalter wrote: post #119
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been extremely wary of how some of the evidence of Covid-19 origins have come about, particular because so much of it has been presented as "Well, we've never seen this before, so it must have lab origins." That said, I think the context around this is extremely damning for Daszak. I didn't realize this until reading the Wikipedia article on Daszak, but he was the one that organized the Feb 2020 letter in the La…

This whole narrative was revealed ages ago by internet reporters, particularly by Dr. Chris Martenson of peakprosperity.com. What's not being reported even in this Intercept article is that Fauci and the Eco Health Alliance are heavily involved with each other. One week before Daszak et al released their ridiculous "lab leak is a conspiracy theory" Lancet article, as revealed in Fauci's emails (which supposedly revea…

Also the state department knew of dangerous research taking place in unsafe conditions at 1-2 years before: https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/03/08/josh-rogin...

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#199

Post by trhway »

That is the same EcoHealth which was doing it in Wuhan :

https://www.bbc.com/news/57932699

"That organization - the US-based EcoHealth Alliance - was awarded grants strating 2014 to look into possible coronaviruses from bats.

EcoHealth received $3.7m from the NIH, $600,000 of which was given to the Wuhan Institute of Virology."

So, in early 2018 they propose specific modifications to the virus, and in the end of 2019 such a modified virus emerges right near their lab...

Btw, in their first $666K (with Wuhan getting $160K) 2014 tranche of the $3.3M grant award, the "Are Human Subjects Involved" is already "Yes" with IRB review already pending - see p.13 here https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/21055989-understandi...

I from the start (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23340283) was saying that one of main reasons of doing it in Wuhan was the human testing.

Re: Leaked grant proposal details high-risk coronavirus research

#200

Post by avs733 »

rhacker wrote: post #124
tootie wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prescient how? This article is about a rejected proposal. Not only did the research not happen, we have no reason to believe this type of research caused the pandemic.

A rejected proposal does not mean research does not happen. It means they were unable to get funding from DARPA. It does not necessarily mean they were unable to get funding from "somebody". And yes we do have reason to believe this type of research caused the pandemic.

As an academic, ain’t no way research from an unfunded grant proposal is happening…

The problem with your second statement is that we all of these posts and articles are attempts to throw evidence to support something you have already decided is true. More bad/non evidence does not make an argument and continually citing bad evidence that doesn’t prove your point reduces the credibility of the argument you are making.

Post reply on HN