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Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

theguardian.com

71–80 of 133 posts

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#71
post #2

Most recently, the apparel world has been roiled by revelations that cotton from Xinjiang, in China, is being grown and processed using forced labour. The scandal implicated some of the world’s biggest brands, including H&M, Nike, Adidas and Gap, and prompted sanctions and restrictions in the west on imports made of Xinjiang cotton. Last August, not long after the US banned all imports containing Xinjiang cotton, US…

I wonder how much "crab" in restaurants is crab.

On the other hand, I wonder how much "seafood soup" is actually the real deal (sharkfin soup)

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#72
post #12
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Care to name which ones do? China, US, probably Russia? Who else?

US, Germany, Russia, Brazil, China, India, etc. The truth is that giving convicted prisoners opportunities to work is probably a big net positive. I'm sure plenty of them would work for pennies rather than rot in a cell. The root of the problem is if there is injustice in sentencing or coercive work conditions. Not the work itself. But that requires far more investigation to establish than pearl-clutching about the u…

> The truth is that giving convicted prisoners opportunities to work is probably a big net positive.

The fact that you used the word "opportunities" to described "forced" really demonstrates the problem with the line of reasoning used to justify forced labor.

Forced labor is wrong. Always. Period.

> I would like to hear reasons why they shouldn't be able to work in a highly controlled, safe workplace.

Sure, if someone is in prison they should be able to work. They should have the choice to work. As soon as the labor is forced, then it is unacceptable, immoral, and anyone defending it is wrong.

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#73
post #71
post #2

Most recently, the apparel world has been roiled by revelations that cotton from Xinjiang, in China, is being grown and processed using forced labour. The scandal implicated some of the world’s biggest brands, including H&M, Nike, Adidas and Gap, and prompted sanctions and restrictions in the west on imports made of Xinjiang cotton. Last August, not long after the US banned all imports containing Xinjiang cotton, US…

I wonder how much "crab" in restaurants is crab. On the other hand, I wonder how much "seafood soup" is actually the real deal (sharkfin soup)

Why does seafood soup imply shark fin soup? Are you not concerned with the ethical concerns around sharkfin soup?

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#74
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, US prison camps are definitely worse due to their scale and history. > Many of these prisons had very recently been slave plantations, Angola and Mississippi State Penitentiary (known as Parchman Farm) among them. https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/09/prison-... Uncomfortable truth. Will probably get flagged.

The forced labor described in the article is unjustifiable. But China imprisoning populations solely for having a different religion and culture is worse than America imprisoning people for (at least mostly) real criminal convictions.

Our criminal justice system is designed to incarcerate black people. A third of black people will be incarcerated at some point in their lives. You're six times as likely to be incarcerated if you're black than if you're white.

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#75

This is an interesting article. It also makes me think that this kind of analysis presents a lot of opportunities. Take for example the Chinese beef being labeled as premium New Zealand beef and sold for much higher prices in supermarkets. If shoppers can't tell the difference without this analysis, then it implies that the price differential between these two products is larger than it should be. That specific Chine…

> If shoppers can't tell the difference without this analysis, then it implies that the price differential between these two products is larger than it should be.

Or that the shopper has misplaced trust in the seller/grocery store.

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#76
post #58
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both media sources rely on speculation from one individual, so why not just link that shared source?

You've made about 20 comments in this thread, mostly demanding sources and then dismissing those sources with vague ad-hominem and making zero attempt to engage with the substance of any claims. Since you seem to be very well educated on this topic, can you share your sources? I'm eager to read them.

My understanding of the "Xinjiang issue" is that Xinjiang has a complex history of separatism & violent terrorism (see Urumqi attacks). Beijing implemented a counterterrorism program in the last decade or two, alongside other initiatives such as comprehensive anti-poverty campaigns. Broadly these programs have the same goal of stabilizing the region, its economy, its politics, its people, and overall they have been successful.

Recognizing China as a competitor on an unchecked rise, Washington "pivoted" its foreign policy on China towards antagonism at the beginning of the Obama admin. [1]

This resulted in a number of related attempts to internally destabilize China and loosen the dominance of the Communist Party, ideally leading to a Chinese regime that is submissive to Washington's demands (as occurred recently in India, Ukraine, Brazil and many other historical cases). Otherwise, China could very well surpass the USA as the most powerful nation on Earth.

Among those attempts is a fierce propaganda initiative, which takes any controversial issue related to China and warps it beyond recognition, with the goal of demonizing the Communist Party. Xinjiang, Hong Kong, COVID-19, Taiwan are among the extremely propagandized topics in circulation.

It is virtually impossible to get a fact-based perspective on these issues from mainstream Western media, because that is not their goal. If a mainstream Western outlet attempts to portray China in a neutral/positive, fact-based light, then they risk repercussions. For example, the illuminating PBS documentary entitled "China's War on Poverty" was removed from the airwaves in USA [2] citing "funding" concerns. Any attempt to deviate from official media policy on China could be labeled a "national security risk" and compromise major media corporation's access to funding and other opportunities. Simply not worth the risk (see Parenti's or Chomsky's "propaganda model").

Meanwhile, extremely dubious "reporting" that furthers this foreign policy agenda is amplified to incredible extents. This is how virtually all "China bad" stories end up tracing their origins from a relatively tiny inbred clique of Washington D.C.-based ideologues/think tanks/"human rights" groups, ETIM separatists, Falun Gong cultists, and weapons manufacturers who stand to profit enormously from the "China Threat" theory. Everyone else is directly or indirectly shut out.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_Asian_foreign_policy_of_t...

[2] - https://current.org/2020/05/after-pbs-drops-film-pbs-socal-r...

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#77
post #2

Most recently, the apparel world has been roiled by revelations that cotton from Xinjiang, in China, is being grown and processed using forced labour. The scandal implicated some of the world’s biggest brands, including H&M, Nike, Adidas and Gap, and prompted sanctions and restrictions in the west on imports made of Xinjiang cotton. Last August, not long after the US banned all imports containing Xinjiang cotton, US…

[deleted]

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#78
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Coercitive" would be something like "you make N license plate a day or don't get food". "If you accept to do non-mandatory work in exchange of money/reduced sentence" it will be your choice.

another way to rephrase that is "if you choose not to work, you will stay in prison for longer." sounds pretty coercive to me!

Not longer that your original sentence though.

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#79

Clearly, the next step is to create a fake origin tracing firm.

That implies a whole other set of dirty tricks available - not only "laundering" products but using it to libel competitors or as a protection racket of sorts. Fungible commodities are a very awkward thing to differentiate, much less trace and proving that there is no basis is hard, especially if there are other counterfeit packagers.

If "Foo Fish" really uses only Pacific Cod but I find a package with Atlantic Cod printed and packed identically how can you prove a disregard for the truth or bad intentions in saying "Foo Fish contains lying mislabeled fish?" I sourced the fish from this store from this wholesaler with the same packaging.

Introducing PPKI could technically help but would be a logistical nightmare and vulnerable to copying.

Re: Food fraud and counterfeit cotton: detectives untangling the global supply chain

#80

This is an interesting article. It also makes me think that this kind of analysis presents a lot of opportunities. Take for example the Chinese beef being labeled as premium New Zealand beef and sold for much higher prices in supermarkets. If shoppers can't tell the difference without this analysis, then it implies that the price differential between these two products is larger than it should be. That specific Chine…

I can't tell the difference between leaded and unleaded gas. So it shouldn't matter if I use leaded gas.
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