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It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

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Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#111

Post by baby »

inter_netuser wrote: post #91
baby wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s why I’m really curious about Algorand. I think they did two interesting things, although I haven’t really looked at it, but they: - removed execution from consensus. I believe consensus just gets the execution result from elsewhere and thus doesn’t get slowed down by execution (the bottleneck when I was working on libra/Diem) - have a random committee that verifies the execution, as opposed to everyone on the…

so individual nodes in Algorand cannot verify the smart contract execution, they must trust the verification committee to some extent?

Yeah that’s my understanding. It should ideally go so quickly that you wouldn’t be able to sync with the blockchain if you were to verify execution.

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#112

Post by aorth »

> Client is on Cloudflare page

... few hours later, after hitting the free 100,000 requests/day limit:

> We've hit the free 100k req/day on @infura_io, and switched to @AlchemyPlatform

But in his own screenshot it shows AlchemyPlatform also has a 100,000 requests/day free limit. Ummm? OK. $436 to deploy a smartcontract, $0 to pay for a server running static HTML and some JavaScript bundle.

> project-memento.com

Wait, what is this? You pay this guy to own a letter in his 20x20 ASCII square? It's a joke, right? Why would someone pay money for that? I will pay you twelve cucumbers to write LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAME from x:0 - y:16 to x:19 - y:16.

"Crypto" hits a new peak insanity every day. Absolutely bonkers.

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#113

Post by proto-n »

gonehome wrote: post #103
proto-n wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really, the computational cost of PoW is not related to the throughput. PoW is not the work that the nodes put into processing transactions, PoW is by definition a useless computation, and it being useless is neccessary for the game theory behind it to work. You can have the same amount of PoW on very little or very high throughput networks, the two are almost completely orthogonal.

You're right that the specific computation of PoW is supposed to be useless for game theory reasons [0], but the computation requirement itself still delays updating the network (while block size constrains how many transactions can happen between each block update). It takes time for those updates to get published back across the network. If you drop the computation requirement and move enforcement to validators and…

> the computation requirement itself still delays updating the network

Yes, but that's intentional and configurable, e.g. the ten minutes of average time between blocks on the btc chain. You could very easily lower that value by modifying the difficulty adjustment formula. The same amount of pow would be done for a unit of time (say 1 hour), but with higher throughput through more frequent blocks. At that point this becomes a discussion about propagation times, network quality and node speeds, all unrelated to pow.

Or am I misunderstanding what you said?

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#114

Post by zamadatix »

aorth wrote: post #112

> Client is on Cloudflare page ... few hours later, after hitting the free 100,000 requests/day limit: > We've hit the free 100k req/day on @infura_io, and switched to @AlchemyPlatform But in his own screenshot it shows AlchemyPlatform also has a 100,000 requests/day free limit. Ummm? OK. $436 to deploy a smartcontract, $0 to pay for a server running static HTML and some JavaScript bundle. > project-memento.com Wait,…

Seems reminiscent of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Million_Dollar_Homepage

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#115

Post by [deleted] »

baby wrote: post #9

I wrote that smart contract as concept art! ( https://cryptologie.net/article/542/project-memento-an-nft-a... ). Nice to see this on the front page :) A few years ago, deploying a smart contract only cost a few dollars. It raised questions like “wouldn’t anyone then spam the blockchain and increase its size in non-scalable way?” I guess pricing “solved” that issue. We considered Avalanche as an alternative, as it sup…

[deleted]

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#116

Post by [deleted] »

Aeolun wrote: post #86
lalaland1125 wrote: post #7

These sorts of extreme costs are inherent to any trustless decentralized system like Ethereum. Storing and verifying contracts across tens if not hundreds of thousands of nodes is not free.

Then they become kind of pointless right? Nobody would get started with this stuff if they didn’t already have a heap of ether from the initial days.

[deleted]

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#117

Post by vmception »

mFixman wrote: post #68

Does anyone know any examples of useful smart contracts on Ethereum? Most of what I hear on the news in either NFTs or toy problems like lotteries.

RSUs, Vesting agreements, Stock/Token options, also with tax withholding for US employees:

We've been doing vesting of assets for 4 years. You can also use an oracle (cron job with conditional metadata) to determine which portions to withhold for taxes under various tax regimes.

You can autoliquidate those tax withheld assets into a liquidity pool if your company needs the liquidity for taxes.

Many projects and services have locked assets but we found it incredibly difficult to conform that concept to the US tax system until we built our own way. What’s onchain is similar to any token lock agreement. Just autoredirecting portions of payouts and autoliquidating for this purpose is still not common.

Although we don't find programmatic vesting to be novel, anymore, and just the tax withholding part to be better: outside of the smart contract space we see a ridiculous amount of overhead, confusion, opaqueness, time and red tape just to accomplish a vesting agreement. So, we aren't evangelizing smart contracts and “blockchain” anymore but we will tell people about the more relatable things that we are doing.

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#118

Post by almostkorean »

mFixman wrote: post #68

Does anyone know any examples of useful smart contracts on Ethereum? Most of what I hear on the news in either NFTs or toy problems like lotteries.

The two most obvious use cases to me are lending/borrowing platforms and decentralized exchanges. In my mind, these two services are basically at feature parity with traditional finance systems but in a decentralized and permissionless system

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#119

Post by almostkorean »

soco wrote: post #109
nybble41 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The recommended way to handle this is to use a URI which uniquely identifies the content, such as an IPFS address. Then, while the data is still stored outside the blockchain, anyone who has a copy can trivially prove that it's authentic and you aren't reliant on a particular server. (Just make sure you save/pin a copy of the file on your own system so it doesn't disappear.) I would agree that an NFT pointing at some…

Okay this is the first time I hear about the IPFS bit. Somehow all I read is missing this point - but it makes fully sense, thank you!

There are also NFTs where the art is “onchain”. See autoglyphs and artblocks

Re: It costs $436 to deploy a smartcontract on Ethereum

#120

Post by xiphias2 »

gonehome wrote: post #105
xiphias2 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ETH had only one war so far (ETH vs ETC) where Vitalik won the leadership role. But at some point governments will want to control Vitalik (which isn't that hard, as he's just 1 person). I believe that something like the blocksize wars with BTC is inevitable in the ETH space as well.

Vitalik's role is dependent on consensus of most of the community - he's not a dictator. He won ETH vs. ETC because the majority of the community thought he was right. If that changes then he'll lose his influence (imo), but from listening to him I think he's a pretty earnest guy and I've been impressed [0]. [0]: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/intellectual-honesty-c...

Does he have the will power and training to go against CIA, NSA, the Chinese government and Putin when they want to add a form of KYC (or crypto primitives that NSA provide to him)?

To tell you the truth, I can't keep up with zero knowledge cryptography that ETH uses / intends to use, and Ethereum implementations are usually buggy.

I can understand Schnorr signatures and Taproot, but even the Musig/Musig2 multi-signature aggregation schemes are too hard for me, so I won't use them for significant amount of money.

Bitcoin codebase is still readable, even though it's getting somewhat more complex over time.

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