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‘Every message was copied to the police’

theguardian.com

111–120 of 193 posts

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Never roll your own security if you actually want security, either. What are we supposed to do :).

Do not rely on technical means to solve an administrative problems. Vito Corleone didn't have messenger apps, email or ERP systems, but his enterprise ran like like a clock. So should yours.

1. That was way before the advent of smart phones and most technological surveillance techniques.

2. It was fictional.

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#112

It is a fascinating case, but apart from the technical aspect of it.. how is that not entrapment? FBI effectively created a tool explicitly designed for criminal element and 'marketed' as such. I would ask about legality, but I am worried its in a very, very grey area.

I am most certainly not a lawyer, but from what i've read entrapment is pretty narrowly defined in America. There's a ton of stuff that many people would view as entrapment that the courts wouldn't consider to be entrapment.

This is one instance though where even from a layperson definition I'm really not sure how this could possibly be interpreted as entrapment.

"The key aspect of entrapment is this: Government agents do not entrap defendants simply by offering them an opportunity to commit a crime. Judges expect people to resist any ordinary temptation to violate the law. An entrapment defense arises when government agents resort to repugnant behavior such as the use of threats, harassment, fraud, or even flattery to induce defendants to commit crimes."[1] [1] https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/entrapment-basics-33...

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recall reading a while back that judges were signing off on surveillance warrants based on messages using any sort of encryption (like https), because obviously anyone encrypting a message is up to no-good. /s ;)

> based on messages using any sort of encryption (like https) I hope you're strongly /s, because if HTTPS being used as transport is enough to rubber-stamp a warrant, then this is in practice a blanket agreement to surveil all communications on the Internet.

Have you ever heard of the nsa and their five eyes buddies?

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole thread here is about penalties for assisting criminal enterprises with a SIM tied to your identity.

And if I place a call for someone on good-faith belief that they need assistance?

I don't get where your point is leading or coming from.

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#115

It is a fascinating case, but apart from the technical aspect of it.. how is that not entrapment? FBI effectively created a tool explicitly designed for criminal element and 'marketed' as such. I would ask about legality, but I am worried its in a very, very grey area.

How so? Selling and using secure messaging apps is perfectly legal, and they never told anyone "go commit [crime X] and plan it with this device"

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#116
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The best solutions are to go low tech. Enforcement models and staffing is reliant on electronic technology. Many enforcement organizations are poorly equipted to handle well implemented physical systems.

I wonder how useful The Solitare Encryption Algorithm would be here - https://www.schneier.com/academic/solitaire/

Solitaire is very broken as an encryption scheme. You should not use it for communication that requires more than LARP security. If you need to encrypt a message manually, LC4 is a better algorithm, but still not acceptable for real world use. The good old one time pad may be most effective.

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recall reading a while back that judges were signing off on surveillance warrants based on messages using any sort of encryption (like https), because obviously anyone encrypting a message is up to no-good. /s ;)

> based on messages using any sort of encryption (like https) I hope you're strongly /s, because if HTTPS being used as transport is enough to rubber-stamp a warrant, then this is in practice a blanket agreement to surveil all communications on the Internet.

[deleted]

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#118

The sad thing about this technology is that it's routinely used, as enumerated in this article, to a completely worthless end. Cocaine should not be illegal anywhere, nor should surveillance stings be set up to entrap people.

>>nor should surveillance stings be set up to entrap people.

You used the word "entrap". I don't think it means what you think it means.

Setting up surveillance of people doing what they independently decide to do on their own, is not entrapment.

Entrapment is when you interact with a target and actively convince them and/or enable them to do a criminal act that they (arguably) would not have done on their own without your prompting/enabling actions.

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#119

> Either because of a lack of technical knowhow, or fear for his safety, Ramos refused, and pleaded guilty to running a criminal enterprise, a charge for which he was sentenced to nine years in prison Wait a second, why would he have to go to prison? If all he did was selling phones, what charges could there possibly be? I'm also missing a third option that he refused to cooperate "for idiological reasons".

> If all he did was selling phones, what charges could there possibly be?

He pleaded guilty to racketeering charges.

https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdca/pr/chief-executive-communi...

Re: ‘Every message was copied to the police’

#120
Every time I read about police investigation techniques that justify the use of mass-surveillance, deception, and entrapment, I grow closer to fully rejecting the legitimacy of criminal law and criminal justice.

The less legitimacy I assign to criminal law and criminal justice, the more infuriating it is that the budgets of law enforcement agencies grow ever more inflated to do ridiculous schemes like this to enforce ridiculous laws against things like drugs or voluntary sex work, and that this cost is seen as more necessary and inevitable by our governments than alleviating poverty or providing essential services like healthcare

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