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Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

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Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#51

Post by spywaregorilla »

mrtksn wrote: post #46
lwansbrough wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Savvy is one way to put it. As an app developer it simply makes me not want to work with Apple at all, but of course I'm forced to for some reason.

Why? I'm excited that a billon dollar company is not treated differently than an indie. I would have hated to negotiate specific terms with Apple and get a bad deal like the way it happens with cloud providers, for example. IMHO, if the commission of Apple or any other rule is to be changed, it should change for everyone(a regulation maybe?). I hated it when Epic simply steamrolled the external payment rule. I don't…

Feels like a weird cognizant dissonance to me. You should antagonize apple for abusing its position against all developers, not celebrate them for not doing it only against the little guy.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#53

Post by spywaregorilla »

ziml77 wrote: post #21
tapoxi wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fortnite doesn't have lootboxes.

I had to look it up myself because I didn't believe you, but it really does appear to be the case that Fortnite doesn't have random loot boxes and they removed them from Rocket League after purchasing that game.

A lawsuit helped them get there, but sweeney's gone on the record to state that random lootboxes should not be a thing. So... net good?

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#55

Post by mrtksn »

spywaregorilla wrote: post #51
mrtksn wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I'm excited that a billon dollar company is not treated differently than an indie. I would have hated to negotiate specific terms with Apple and get a bad deal like the way it happens with cloud providers, for example. IMHO, if the commission of Apple or any other rule is to be changed, it should change for everyone(a regulation maybe?). I hated it when Epic simply steamrolled the external payment rule. I don't…

Feels like a weird cognizant dissonance to me. You should antagonize apple for abusing its position against all developers, not celebrate them for not doing it only against the little guy.

I don’t think it’s an abuse, it’s simply a business. Apple holds the minority share of smartphones WW. It’s perfectly possible not to do work on their platform if the terms are not good.

I’m annoyed when they sherlock someone but not when they stick to the agreement they made with the developers.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#56

Post by spywaregorilla »

api wrote: post #10
bnt wrote: post #8

Rich guy complaining about another Rich guy. I don't care. If this was a small app developer complaining, I would care. The more little devs complain, the more can come together and sue the crap out of Apple. 1 big Co suing another big Co = nobody cares. Tim isn't helping the small developers, he just wants to make more money for himself. Small devs will still get screwed.

Yeah honestly neither of these two have our best interests in mind. Apple wants to keep their walled garden walled, and these game companies want to make it easier to exploit quasi-gambling "loot box" and similar revenue centers without paying Apple. There are also a lot of vendors who want to bypass Apple so they can bypass Apple's privacy protections. The entire mobile ecosystem is full of user-hostile business mod…

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-51502592

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#57

Post by barelysapient »

jlmorton wrote: post #36
wetjen wrote: post #25

This is simply savvy maneuvering by apple. Frequently these cases are appealed and new terms introduced to the judgement. Apple doesn’t want to give away any negotiating position until this is fully resolved.

Is it really that savvy? The golden goose is the iPhone itself, and the network effects of things like iMessage that keep people there. Services have a high margin, and make up a substantial chunk of Apple's profits, but they are dependent on a big iOS ecosystem. Fortnite has 116 million iOS users, and a lot of them are pretty into the game. I don't think keeping Fortnite off iOS is going to have an immediate impact…

I bet you're right--Apple would prefer to have Fortnite and and corresponding revenue and userbase back on their platform.

But this case isn't over. There's almost certain to be an appealed. Apple wants to maximize their position in the event the next judgement is less favorable. And the short-term cost of users and revenue is worthwhile hedge against the unknown.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#58

Post by Factorium »

literallyaduck wrote: post #49

Epic, Steam, and Framework should team up to build a user centric phone which runs Arch not Android and runs all their games.

Valve are definitely not user-centred. They are profit centred. Valve provide no subsidised hardware (PC gamers still need to supply their own), and charge indie developers 30% commissions, a regressive 'tax' compared to the 20% they charge AAA.

Per-employee, Valve is the most profitable company in America, and Gabe Newell the 97th richest American. They got there with forced exclusives (Half Life 2 could only be activated on Steam) and simply being first to market. They are no longer even bothering to curate their storefront.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#59

Post by matt_heimer »

Anyone know where Apple stated they'd "welcome Epic’s return to the App Store if they agree to play by the same rules as everyone else" as Tim states?

I see where Apple said everybody should play by the same rules but given that Epic not only violated the policy (which has now been changed) but also purposely cheated on the review process it seems justified that they are still banned.

Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted

#60

Post by MikeDelta »

mdoms wrote: post #35
lwansbrough wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Savvy is one way to put it. As an app developer it simply makes me not want to work with Apple at all, but of course I'm forced to for some reason.

No one is forced to work with apple. I've been developing software for 15 years and never once touched xcode or iOS. Working with apple is a choice you make.

If you want to sell mobile apps that you cannot run from a browser, then choosing not to enter Apple's ecosystem will keep you from a very large user base.

It is a choice you make, but with significant business consequences.

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