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Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

reuters.com

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Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#131

Post by reginold »

game_the0ry wrote: post #128

I'm really not sure how serious I should take the threat of Chinese made electronics - almost all electronics are made China, not just Xaiomi and Hauwei. My iphone is made in China by Chinese contract manufacturer (Foxconn) - does that mean all iphones could be compromised with Chinese malware? It could be possible, but how can you tell? Is it possible to observe network packets going form my phone to a Chinese or Ch…

As far as I can tell, the meta solution here is open source hardware and software. Otherwise it just doesn't matter who is doing this, why they do it, or who is affected.

The core issue is the lack of end to end encryption and open source hardware and software. Options today are okay, but they need to be great to reach the right people. See my post in this thread about Pinephone and Librem.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#132

Post by reginold »

abakker wrote: post #130
reginold wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are more powerful than you may realize. Work on supporting open source hardware and software options. 1. If you are a developer, consider buying a Pinephone [1] and contributing to the codebase. 2. If not a developer, you can submit bug reports and test fixes. Same for Purism Librem phone as well [2]. 3. If you are neither, or have no time to spare but do have money, you can always purchase one for kicks or donat…

I hate to say this, but OSS anarchism is not going to work. Most people cannot really work or live with those devices. This is a problem that needs to be solved with legislation, lobbying, superPACs, and candidates who are not ethically flexible. The solution to bad government is not "no government" and the solution to bad company behavior is better rules.

Open to other ways of taking action. What are you doing to support the solutions you describe?

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#133

Post by reginold »

avodonosov wrote: post #119
reginold wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what you're saying or intending with your comments. There are 32 pages in the report. I'm curious about steps to replicate as well, generally for stuff like this.

I mean the piece quoted above is the correct original source. I wanted to post exactly this snippet myself. From that a possible test case can be to open this HN thread in MiBrowser and see the webpage blocked due to the "free Tibet" phrases posted here (assuming MiAdBlacklistConfig includes English versions). If anyone has a Xiaomi phone and is willing to accept the MiBrowser terms of use, please try.

Right. MiAdBlackListConfig does not include English versions, according to the 32 page research article. Therefore "Free Tibet" is not relevant.

A user here testing this is irrelevant. If someone wants to verify, figure out where we can get the codebase and search these strings ourselves.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#135

Post by game_the0ry »

reginold wrote: post #131
game_the0ry wrote: post #128

I'm really not sure how serious I should take the threat of Chinese made electronics - almost all electronics are made China, not just Xaiomi and Hauwei. My iphone is made in China by Chinese contract manufacturer (Foxconn) - does that mean all iphones could be compromised with Chinese malware? It could be possible, but how can you tell? Is it possible to observe network packets going form my phone to a Chinese or Ch…

As far as I can tell, the meta solution here is open source hardware and software. Otherwise it just doesn't matter who is doing this, why they do it, or who is affected. The core issue is the lack of end to end encryption and open source hardware and software. Options today are okay, but they need to be great to reach the right people. See my post in this thread about Pinephone and Librem.

> As far as I can tell, the meta solution here is open source hardware and software. Otherwise it just doesn't matter who is doing this, why they do it, or who is affected.

I agree with you there, but I want to know how to analyze devices that are closed source.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#136

Post by jl6 »

game_the0ry wrote: post #128

I'm really not sure how serious I should take the threat of Chinese made electronics - almost all electronics are made China, not just Xaiomi and Hauwei. My iphone is made in China by Chinese contract manufacturer (Foxconn) - does that mean all iphones could be compromised with Chinese malware? It could be possible, but how can you tell? Is it possible to observe network packets going form my phone to a Chinese or Ch…

Network isn’t even the only egress route out of a cellphone. They have sophisticated radios, so a low-level (e.g. on-silicon) backdoor could send your data out to a nearby agent using all manner of electro-magnetic emissions.

You just have to trust the manufacturer and its supply chain, and that applies to open source too.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#137

Post by techrat »

game_the0ry wrote: post #128

I'm really not sure how serious I should take the threat of Chinese made electronics - almost all electronics are made China, not just Xaiomi and Hauwei. My iphone is made in China by Chinese contract manufacturer (Foxconn) - does that mean all iphones could be compromised with Chinese malware? It could be possible, but how can you tell? Is it possible to observe network packets going form my phone to a Chinese or Ch…

"made" in this case tends to refer to created, not just manufactured. it (as the article states) is mostly an issue for chinese brands with poor quality control or ulterior motives.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#138

Post by ignoramous »

abakker wrote: post #130
reginold wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are more powerful than you may realize. Work on supporting open source hardware and software options. 1. If you are a developer, consider buying a Pinephone [1] and contributing to the codebase. 2. If not a developer, you can submit bug reports and test fixes. Same for Purism Librem phone as well [2]. 3. If you are neither, or have no time to spare but do have money, you can always purchase one for kicks or donat…

I hate to say this, but OSS anarchism is not going to work. Most people cannot really work or live with those devices. This is a problem that needs to be solved with legislation, lobbying, superPACs, and candidates who are not ethically flexible. The solution to bad government is not "no government" and the solution to bad company behavior is better rules.

> I hate to say this, but OSS anarchism is not going to work. Most people cannot really work or live with those devices.

Baby steps. Such changes start small.

> This is a problem that needs to be solved with legislation, lobbying, superPACs, and candidates who are not ethically flexible.

Yes, but regulations do also ring-in different challenges and over the long-term, the status-quo ends up being enshrined in them, thwarting the otherwise thriving diversity of the ecosystem. Though, it is inevitable Internet / Web gets regulated ala Finance / Telecommunications industries.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#139

Post by oseityphelysiol »

trasz wrote: post #109
no_way wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can read the report and literally look up file on your Xiaomi phone which contains censored words.

Most people don't have Xiaomi phones. And it's worth noting that the document only mentions some of those, from over 300 entries. What are the others and why were they redacted out?

Thet are very common in Lithuania, to the point where I’d say around 20% of new phones being sold are from Xiaomi. They expanded heavily into other industries, like home automation, with prices that are a fraction of what other manufacturers would ask for their hardware.

Re: Lithuania says throw away Chinese phones due to censorship concerns

#140

Post by mzs »

bitcurious wrote: post #79
ignoramous wrote: post #45

There are no details really as to how Xiaomi censors those terms. If one does not use the bundled-in browser / app-store, I doubt Xiaomi can censor anything at all in other browsers unless they MiTM with client-cert. OTOH, many popular non-browser apps (at least the ones that matter) pin certificates, so even Lenovo-esque shenanigans wouldn't work [0]. What can they possibly be doing in the firmware or the ROM to bre…

Off the top of my head, theu can censor at the keyboard level, at the SMS level, and at the camera level: https://www.reddit.com/r/Xiaomi/comments/pgk8y3/xiaomi_camer...

I don't think that camera thing was censorship, instead bug:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Xiaomi/comments/pgk8y3/comment/hbf5...

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28395885

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