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The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

pluralistic.net

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Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#51
post #41
post #7

This looks really cool, but the author... is... replacing their laptop every year ? Like, I'm writing this on an 8 year old MBP that has survived as my round-the-house driver because it still does everything well. My daily driver is getting on a bit now (3yr) and my desktop only just got replaced after 5 years. Forget the cost, but the waste!

"the author" here is well known writer Cory Doctorow. No one here seems to be making this connection, but pluralistic.net is his blog.

[deleted]

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#52
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

Well no, you and people like you don’t, but as evidenced by all the people buying this there is a segment of the market that clearly does.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#53
post #7

This looks really cool, but the author... is... replacing their laptop every year ? Like, I'm writing this on an 8 year old MBP that has survived as my round-the-house driver because it still does everything well. My daily driver is getting on a bit now (3yr) and my desktop only just got replaced after 5 years. Forget the cost, but the waste!

Back when I was making crap wages, I would get the cheapest laptops I could afford that would more or less give me decent performance (on the order of ~$500-600). It's not too hard to find a new laptop that performs well at a reasonable price, but you always run the risk of them reclaiming those costs by cheaping out on all the mechanics of it, and it's not like I was able to afford paying ~$2000 for a high-quality machine. Usually within 2 years, the laptop would just start falling apart, I would get sad, and then I would repeat the pattern.

After the fourth or so time of doing this, and after getting higher-paying jobs, I ended up biting the bullet for a more expensive computer, and it lasted me five years, and I only replaced it because I wanted more RAM.

Point is, if you're lower-income, it's fairly easy to get stuck in the "one laptop a year" trend, because, while probably a better deal in the long term, it's really hard for lower-income to justify a multi-thousand dollar expense. I'm a proper tech bro now so buying a good computer isn't the worst thing in the world for me, but that wasn't always the case.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#54
post #25

It feels like for years we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable", and I guess at some level I believed that, and just accepted that laptops with upgradable components were a thing of the past. After seeing the framework, I'm more than a little annoyed that I fell for this. They proved you can have a slim, clean laptop that's somewhat modular…

Do you actually have any example of a corporation that makes laptops saying that it’s impossible to have slim laptops that are customizable? I would be very surprised if this ever happened, but I’m willing to be proven wrong.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#55
post #23

I'm trying to hold out for an AMD cpu on the framework but I might not be able to wait much longer.

Ditto.

My other deal breaker is the fit & finish of Mac's touchpad. The qwan of it.

If frame.work + Ubuntu come within striking distance, I'd buy.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#56
post #7

This looks really cool, but the author... is... replacing their laptop every year ? Like, I'm writing this on an 8 year old MBP that has survived as my round-the-house driver because it still does everything well. My daily driver is getting on a bit now (3yr) and my desktop only just got replaced after 5 years. Forget the cost, but the waste!

>> replacing their laptop every year? Not really that uncommon especially with a MacBook Pro where a new one is released...every year. How much sense it makes, that's another story.

Ignoring the (potentially substantial) environmental costs, if you do it "correctly" the total cost of ownership is about the same.

If you buy a $2000 Mac and use it for as long as reasonably, it's going to depreciate by several hundred dollars (let's say, roughly $300) a year. At a certain point it's worth nearly zero, and you must buy a new laptop. After 6-7 years your total outlay is $2000.

Alternatively, every year or two you can sell the old one for a few hundred dollars less than the new model, and buy the new model. You always have a new laptop. And your total outlay is still only about $2000. Plus you are covered by free AppleCare every time you buy the new one.

Plenty of people do this with mobile phones and automobiles and other things as well.

Please note that I am not advocating it. I was still using my 2015 laptop until very recently. But economically it is not necessarily insane.

(Assuming you are selling the old laptops, that is. It's not clear to me that the author is doing that. He says he's donating/rehoming them. Not sure if that includes selling)

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#57
post #49

>That tool – a small screwdriver – is also sufficient to upgrade the CPU CPU isn't up-gradable without switching out the entire mainboard, which I'm fine with, once I get an AMD version that is :)

ive seen a lot of requests for an AMD version but i always see people complain about AMD's linux support. Do you plan on running windows? If you are planning on Linux is the support really as bad as people complain. I say that because intel's linux support seems to me as top notch. ive never really had driver issues that i can think of

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#58
post #7

This looks really cool, but the author... is... replacing their laptop every year ? Like, I'm writing this on an 8 year old MBP that has survived as my round-the-house driver because it still does everything well. My daily driver is getting on a bit now (3yr) and my desktop only just got replaced after 5 years. Forget the cost, but the waste!

As the other comments have noted, Cory addresses this further down in the linked post. He further expanded on this in the post he wrote when he quit smoking[0]:

> That was my homework: go away and think of an immediate reason not to smoke. When I came back, I had my answer ready: “I spend two laptops per year on smokes. That money goes directly to the dirtiest companies on Earth, the literal inventors of the science-denial playbook that is responsible for our inaction on climate change. Those companies’ sole mission is to murder me and all my friends. I’m going to quit smoking and I’m going to buy a laptop this year and every year hereafter, and I’ll still be up one laptop per year.”

[0]: https://doctorow.medium.com/i-quit-9ae7b6010c99

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#59

Thank you for the writeup, it seems like they have done a great job with The Framework. Does it come in that beige-looking color shown on the yellow background? I think I might want a beige laptop, something with the fine lines of The Framework and the raw aesthetic appeal of Lappy 486.

And don't forget that classy startup noise.
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