6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden? • Hacker News Board

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#201

Post by mariuolo » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 10:06 AM UTC

_abox wrote: post #197

mariuolo wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They've never been team players. Don't forget they were happily building Nazi tank parts in WWII while playing nice with the allies. Please tell me what they could have done instead, being locked between a nazi-occupied country (Norway), one at war and partially occupied by the Soviets (Finland) and with a military monster to the south. Sweden had to play nice or risk being squashed like a bug. Pretty much the same…

Understood, I never really got why the Nazis left Sweden alone but did go after Norway and Denmark. And at the same time were so hell-bent on conquering the empty deserts in North Africa. But those ball bearings and other parts helped kill a lot of allies.

> Understood, I never really got why the Nazis left Sweden alone but did go after Norway and Denmark. And at the same time were so hell-bent on conquering the empty deserts in North Africa.

Because Sweden had a credible military. Not that she could have resisted indefinitely to a German invasion, but subduing her would have taken time the Axis did not have.

> And at the same time were so hell-bent on conquering the empty deserts in North Africa.

Sweden was neutral. Britain and Free France weren't.

> But those ball bearings and other parts helped kill a lot of allies.

Poland was an ally. It was split between Germany and the Soviet Union (and sold off to the Soviets after the war, but that was yet to come). Do you think Sweden should have sacrificed herself after seeing that?

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#202

Post by neuronic » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 10:46 AM UTC

DarkByte8 wrote: post #81

neuronic wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The next generation of bullshit military spending? A trillion for Afghanistan and F-35 each . Jeez, what could we have built with $2 trillion in investments? What cool companies, technologies or infrastructure could have sprung from this?

The kind that would be bombed by China if we would not erase the existence of winnie the pooh.

The amount of bullshit in this post… wow. China doesn’t give a fuck about US mainland.

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#203

Post by kukx » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 11:55 AM UTC

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #120

kybernetikos wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I looked into this a few years back and the cost/benefit of the initial use of atomic weapons is not as cut and dried as many people believe. That's not really the topic here though. It's absolutely true that weapons can be tools for peace, but I don't think that is how the projects in Afghanistan and Iraq played out. Even with the best intentions the fact that it is a military operation planned by military leaders a…

The US uses war to export its domestic issues abroad. War is the primary conduit and excuse for corporate welfare. Some of this goes into jobs. Occasionally - exceptionally, and less often than most people realise - some of it spins off into useful civilian tech. But most of it is just free money for nothing much to not very nice people. Some of whom use it to buy political influence. And some of whom use existing po…

Be careful with conspiracy theories. Some people get banned for them. While they are sometimes true (eg Watergate), usually they are not.

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#204

Post by eitland » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 1:17 PM UTC

wombatmobile wrote: post #195

eitland wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is the West had just experienced the failure that was to try to make peace with a mad dictator (Hitler) a few decades before. Also the Communists were quite open about their plans for world domination.

Hitler was killed in 1945. Are you saying the West was unable to distinguish between Hitler and other world leaders, 20 years later? That sounds like a cognitive bias, akin to PTSD. Surely it would be better for the world to develop therapies for that cognitive bias instead of going to war. > Also the Communists were quite open about their plans for world domination. Didn't the Russians defeat Hitler, at the cost of…

> Are you saying the West was unable to distinguish between Hitler and other world leaders, 20 years later?

Stalin was almost every bit as bad as Hitler and outlasted him by almost a decade.

Others were just as bad just less "successful".

Also, after a painful lesson in dealing with mad dictators I'm actually glad the west didn't forget the lesson so fast.

> Didn't the Russians defeat Hitler, at the cost of 22 million Russian casualties?

I give you this, this is partially true:

They absolutely played a huge part in it but were themselves saved by Churchill after doing the same blunder as the west: trusting Hitler.

> What plans for world domination are you referring to?

Please do read up on the history of international Communism and Socialism.

> Can you point to any act of armed aggression by the Russians against a Western government?

Besides numerous proxy wars, occupying half of Europe, and, more recently starting a war against Ukraine and shooting down MH-17?

> Can you point to any act of armed aggression by the Chinese Communist Part against a western government?

They haven't dared that quite yet as far as I know but they've broken the agreement with Britain about Hong Kong quite thoroughly, they keep stealing fish (note: the west has also been guilty of this).

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#205

Post by wombatmobile » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 2:39 PM UTC

eitland wrote: post #204

wombatmobile wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hitler was killed in 1945. Are you saying the West was unable to distinguish between Hitler and other world leaders, 20 years later? That sounds like a cognitive bias, akin to PTSD. Surely it would be better for the world to develop therapies for that cognitive bias instead of going to war. > Also the Communists were quite open about their plans for world domination. Didn't the Russians defeat Hitler, at the cost of…

> Are you saying the West was unable to distinguish between Hitler and other world leaders, 20 years later? Stalin was almost every bit as bad as Hitler and outlasted him by almost a decade. Others were just as bad just less "successful". Also, after a painful lesson in dealing with mad dictators I'm actually glad the west didn't forget the lesson so fast. > Didn't the Russians defeat Hitler, at the cost of 22 millio…

> They haven't dared that quite yet as far as I know but they've broken the agreement with Britain about Hong Kong quite thoroughly,

What do you know about the history behind the "agreement with Britain about Hong Kong"?

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#206

Post by indymike » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 2:48 PM UTC

alasdair_ wrote: post #184

indymike wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Taiwan would be gone, Korea unified under Kim Jong Un. The soviet union would not have fallen. The world would be radically different.

Would the US actually get into a major conflict with China over Taiwan? I could see a skirmish, but Ukraine has made it clear that the US will not defend its (non-NATO) allies in the face of full scale warfare.

An invasion of Taiwan would result in World War III in about 5 minutes. Seeing Taiwan through the eyes of Eastern Europe would be a mistake. The stakes are well understood, and giving up Taiwan would destabilize Japan, Korea, Australia, Indonesia and India, not a single one of which is acceptable to the US.

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#207

Post by eitland » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 3:03 PM UTC

wombatmobile wrote: post #205

eitland wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you saying the West was unable to distinguish between Hitler and other world leaders, 20 years later? Stalin was almost every bit as bad as Hitler and outlasted him by almost a decade. Others were just as bad just less "successful". Also, after a painful lesson in dealing with mad dictators I'm actually glad the west didn't forget the lesson so fast. > Didn't the Russians defeat Hitler, at the cost of 22 millio…

> They haven't dared that quite yet as far as I know but they've broken the agreement with Britain about Hong Kong quite thoroughly, What do you know about the history behind the "agreement with Britain about Hong Kong"?

You can look it up quite easily. That way you don't have to trust me and my interpretation :-)

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#208

Post by angelzen » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 3:10 PM UTC

Guthur wrote: post #194

angelzen wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By the time all is said and done the drones of the NeoOttoman empire would have long taken over Europe. I for one am totally looking for the looming Caffa reboot.

Is that a mod for HoI 4?

It's a mod for RealLife 1, beta-tested with the Caucasus campaign.

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#209

Post by light_hue_1 » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 7:34 PM UTC

cvwright wrote: post #172

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure it wasn't NATO that kept France from invading Germany, and vice versa. Or kept Spain from attempting to annex Portugal. Or even just Gibraltar. But please provide some citations if that's incorrect.

The problem with this theory is that people thought the same thing before WW1. Know who was the biggest trading partner for France and Germany in 1914? It was each other.

This isn't the theory people used before WW1.

This is exactly why the EU is not just an economic union, it's a political and judicial one as well. No on before WW1 would have even considered the idea that a French judge in a common European court could tell the German government what they can or can't do with respect to their own internal laws. Today, this is routine.

Re: 6th Generation Stealth Fighter: Joint Effort by UK, Japan, Italy and Sweden?

#210

Post by light_hue_1 » Sun, Sep 19, 2021, 7:42 PM UTC

publicola1990 wrote: post #182

Bronze_Colossus wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Putin has not shown to be an reliable ally. The annexation of Crimea and the ongoing hybrid war in east Ukraine is one such example. Putin does not want a strong independent ally next to Russia. He either wants puppet states such as Belarus as allies or a weak and fractured European union. For all the faults the US have they are still better allies than Russia by several lightyears.

May be if granted a buffer zone of influence, Russia will be a reliable partner to Europe. To me it is Europe (and the US) that is picking ideological battlegrounds, and showing eagerness to start a new cold war.

Granted a buffer zone of influence?

Let me rephrase that for you from the perspective of someone who lived on Russia's doorstep for many years.

You mean to say "Maybe if we let Russia subjugate a lot more people and confine them into an evil exploitative system against their will".

That's the big difference between Europe's zone of influence and Russia's zone of influence. People want to be part of the EU (the greatest thing that ever happened to the country I was born in). People want to give their lives to not be part of Russia.