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For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

thetimes.co.uk

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Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#61

Post by chrisseaton »

Jensson wrote: post #58
chrisseaton wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You go there to do college studies An undergraduate degree isn't 'college studies' in British English. Nobody would say that. > why say it is wrong to call it a college? Why is it wrong to call it a fish? Because it's not a fish. Why is it wrong to call it a college? Because it's not a college.

But this is a mostly American forum? Why say it is wrong to use the American word? Everyone understands what the poster meant. You wouldn't correct someone using the American billion just because it happened to be about a UK company either.

Seems rude to mis-title something or someone from another culture?

Like all these lunatics yesterday talking about 'Sir Sinclair'.

Calling it a 'college' makes it sound like something less than it is. I would try not to mis-title things from another culture myself.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#62

Post by cafard »

bencollier49 wrote: post #3

Due to student satisfaction. It should be noted that Scottish students don't pay (significant) tuition fees.

It can be an economical option for American students. A young woman from my neighborhood in Washington, DC, just finished here degree there.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#63

Post by arethuza »

Jensson wrote: post #57
arethuza wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in the UK "college" means a variety of things, none of which apply to St Andrews?

But this is a mostly American forum? Why say it is wrong to use the American word? Everyone understands what the poster meant. You wouldn't correct someone using the American billion just because it happened to be about a UK company either.

Given the time of day and the subject matter I suspect most people discussing this on here are not from the US.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#64

Post by ThePhysicist »

wanderingmind wrote: post #59
ThePhysicist wrote: post #10

As a student I used to obsess over university rankings, but I realize now that most of them are massively gamed. My alma mater, the UPMC (Université Pierre et Marie Curie) e.g. merged with other universities in Paris to form the Sorbonne University, mostly to move up in the worldwide ranking. So, it's still largely the same university with the same funding and the same chairs, but since it's bundled up in a larger pa…

Or even better is just not do a PhD. Doing a PhD is one of the worst things that most people do to themselves. It mainly exists to provide cheap labour to exploitive universities while creating a huge opportunity cost for students. And worse does not provide any employable skills to more than 9 out of 10 PhDs who need to find a job outside academia. If you are thinking of doing a PhD you are better off just doing a m…

Some things are hard to do outside a PhD or research context. I knew my PhD probably wouldn't "pay off" financially but that wasn't the goal to begin with. It gave me the opportunity to do some great research and work with amazing people, so I'm really happy to have done it. I also did research as part of my Diploma (M.Sc.) thesis, but it's just not comparable to a PhD.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#65

Post by avnigo »

wanderingmind wrote: post #59
ThePhysicist wrote: post #10

As a student I used to obsess over university rankings, but I realize now that most of them are massively gamed. My alma mater, the UPMC (Université Pierre et Marie Curie) e.g. merged with other universities in Paris to form the Sorbonne University, mostly to move up in the worldwide ranking. So, it's still largely the same university with the same funding and the same chairs, but since it's bundled up in a larger pa…

Or even better is just not do a PhD. Doing a PhD is one of the worst things that most people do to themselves. It mainly exists to provide cheap labour to exploitive universities while creating a huge opportunity cost for students. And worse does not provide any employable skills to more than 9 out of 10 PhDs who need to find a job outside academia. If you are thinking of doing a PhD you are better off just doing a m…

I agree, but like you said, PhDs are valued more in terms of career progression and prospects for those working in research and academia, and if you don't get on that PhD train, you just kinda stall.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#66

Post by jack_riminton »

chrisseaton wrote: post #15
jack_riminton wrote: post #2

Whenever a rankings table comes out with a result like this it probably succeeds in selling some papers, but it also diminishes the esteem of the rankings table I'm sure that St Andrews is a brilliant college. But very few in academia would say its as brilliant as Oxbridge

> I'm sure that St Andrews is a brilliant college. It's not a 'college' at all.

Whoosh

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#69

Post by Sanguinaire »

Jensson wrote: post #57
arethuza wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in the UK "college" means a variety of things, none of which apply to St Andrews?

But this is a mostly American forum? Why say it is wrong to use the American word? Everyone understands what the poster meant. You wouldn't correct someone using the American billion just because it happened to be about a UK company either.

"College" in the UK education system already has a definition; it is the place you go from 16 to 18, studying a narrower curriculum than regular school prior to 16. You will also hear references to "sixth form college", which is the same 16-18 education but delivered at the same physical school as under-16 teaching.

Re: For the first time in history, St Andrews outranks Oxbridge

#70

Post by 8bitsrule »

chrisseaton wrote: post #15
jack_riminton wrote: post #2

Whenever a rankings table comes out with a result like this it probably succeeds in selling some papers, but it also diminishes the esteem of the rankings table I'm sure that St Andrews is a brilliant college. But very few in academia would say its as brilliant as Oxbridge

> I'm sure that St Andrews is a brilliant college. It's not a 'college' at all.

In US colloquial English the term 'college' is used to refer to ANY academic (non-trade) schools where a 'college' degree (above 'high' school) can be earned. Like it or lump it.

This is hardly a 'slam' for St Andrews; aluminum is more concise than aluminium, as is 'math' compared to 'maths'.

In the US a 'public' school is -not- elite (fee-charging); the general 'public' is welcome there. Not just stuck-up nit-pickers.

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