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Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

reuters.com

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Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#181

Post by machomaster »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #111
seniorivn wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it is possible, but it's also true that telegram bot is the only platform of Navalny smart vote service that keeps working(aside text file circulating all over the internet)

I wonder why all modern hipsters ignore email as a platform. Like, Telegram on behest of Apple and Google repeatedly bans flibusta bots (a site with a great collection of pirated books), why don't they make an email bot? What would Apple do, ban their own mail app? Start censoring emails?

0. Well, it is being done when possible. But it's not a 100% way of reaching people. 1. State terrorism. People are genuinely afraid to give their email addresses, and for a good reason. 2. Email delivery. Email doesn't work as good as you think. In addition to the typical technical email delivery problems, there are also specific to Russia. Many people are using local Russian email services. But those have shown to be dependent on Kremlin. For example Smart Voting lists had "strange" delivery problems for recipient in the mail.ru service (one of the most popular in Russia).

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#182

Post by concordDance »

Grustaf wrote: post #75
yawaworht1978 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have they ever explained why the csam would be implemented? Apple bends just fine if the government is powerful enough and the marketplace is big enough, see China.

Perhaps they don't want people to use their devices for child abuse? Radical idea I know.

Are they stopping the pictures being taken? Because the actual cloud uploading isn't child abuse, it's 90% the taking and 10% the sharing with other human beings. (Which only applies to the small subset of casm which is child abuse, rather than the majority which is "sexy" selfies)

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#184

Post by toiletfuneral »

throw_m239339 wrote: post #148
simonh wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I posted a sibling comment to your about Russia and the general point. I'll try not to repeat myself but China is very close to my heart as my wife is Chinese and therefore so is half of my family. My wife's father's family were brutally oppressed by the Communists. To this day he gets upset, and I've seen him burst into tears when talking about what they did to some of his relatives in the 50s and 60s. This is the t…

> None of them think refusing to trade with china is in Chinese citizens best interests. Well, then is it a matter of principle for western democracies or not? Meanwhile, the west is financing the CCP.

Principle? Dude have ever read anything about Kissinger or dulles? And do you think institutional investors are as nationalist as you?

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#185

Post by fsflover »

simonh wrote: post #108
Wolfenstein98k wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pull out of the countries then. Participating in dictatorship is barely better than refusing to do so if that dictatorship will falsely imprison your employees.

Even Navalny and his supporters are not calling for foreign companies to all pull out of Russia. What makes you think you know better what is good for the Russian people and the opposition groups than Russians and the opposition groups themselves? How many of Russia's Apple employees think Apple is "participating in dictatorship" by employing them? How many Russian citizens, including the political opposition, do you…

The actual problem is not that Apple removed the app. It's that there is no other way to install the app if Apple removes it from their store.

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#186

Post by Dah00n »

Arech wrote: post #73
elephantum wrote: post #69

The thing is, that it's all very time-sensitive. And I expect pressure was unreasonably high. We have elections in Russia this weekend and Navalny app was used as a tool to coordinate protest voting. It is called "Smart Voting" by Navalny team and it is getting a lot of attention for upcomping elections. If Apple and Google would just be a little bit slower and complied next Monday :) Still there are more ways to coo…

Please don't call it elections. Nothing even close.

Well, it's all in the eye of the beholder. As someone living in Scandinavia looking at the US that doesn't look like elections much either.

Pick your favourite animal:

A: Black horse

B: Brown horse

Z: Pony

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#187

Post by machomaster »

Grustaf wrote: post #134
kurokikaze wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the main party line right now - "Navalny is Soros' agent and Smart Voting is election interference".

I don't know about Soros, but e.g. the Swedish government is supporting him quite heavily. Would you consider Smart Voting to be "interference" if Chinese backed activists promoted it in the US?

Of course not, especially if the interference is on the level of "One activist's teenage daughter has a TikTok account" like it is in Navalny's case.

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#188

Post by boudin »

mrtksn wrote: post #61
boudin wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Integrity? That just show what their priorities are.

Integrity of what exactly?

This is the definition of Integrity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrity

It means that whatever apple says, they are only driven by the market. Any stance they have on privacy or security is pure bullshit, they don't and will never give a crap about it, they only care about their revenue, otherwise they wouldn't be in China for example.

In this case, it proves that whatever they say about their stupid store and authoritarian approach to it, it is not and will never be in the interest of their users. It is just to make it easy for apple to enforce anything, whatever the source of the decision is, a dictator like here, or to destroy competition before launching their own crap like their keyboard on their watch.

If apple would have cared once about their customers, they wouldn't have created an ecosystem that jailed them and would still make it easy for users to install the app they want.

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#189

Post by cheschire »

Grustaf wrote: post #75
yawaworht1978 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have they ever explained why the csam would be implemented? Apple bends just fine if the government is powerful enough and the marketplace is big enough, see China.

Perhaps they don't want people to use their devices for child abuse? Radical idea I know.

You’re not wrong, it could be as simple as that. What’s got some people up in arms isn’t that.

The police in America have proven repeatedly that they will ignore individual freedoms to look indiscriminately for people doing bad things.

Apple creates a tool that enables pattern matching without consent. But they promise they won’t use it for more than CSAM, and that only they will hold the keys.

Okay so imagine that your HOA enacts a rule they’re now allowed to review all of your purchases by comparing known hashes used by drug lords to determine if you are cooking meth in your basement. And if they find a match, without your knowledge, they will report you to the police who will have a defensible justification for a warrant to come enter your house and look for meth lab stuff. Sounds fine as long as you have nothing worth hiding right? Might as well let them just go through everyone’s house preemptively looking for meth labs and skip the hash checking right? Oh you don’t support that leap? Don’t worry, others do.

Re: Google, Apple remove Navalny app from stores as Russian elections begin

#190

Post by Grustaf »

machomaster wrote: post #187
Grustaf wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about Soros, but e.g. the Swedish government is supporting him quite heavily. Would you consider Smart Voting to be "interference" if Chinese backed activists promoted it in the US?

Of course not, especially if the interference is on the level of "One activist's teenage daughter has a TikTok account" like it is in Navalny's case.

I thought Navalny was better organized than that, given the millions we shower him with and his 50+ staff.
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